a question for those who dislliked Back to Earth

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by bedfordfalls, Apr 24, 2011.

  1. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    Regardless of how funny you found the special do you or do you not find yourself welling up and blubbering like a baby when Lister delivers his final monologue to Kochanski?

    For me I think this is the peak of pathos in a show that has had some fine moments over the years. There is so much hope and beauty contained in his delivery and in the rediscovered optimism and self-belief that first led us to fall in love with the character. In my view no lines of dialogue in the show's history come close to making us root for one of its characters (Out of Time's "Well I say fight" is a close second) more than those three words delivered with that irrepressible smile:

    "Yeah...I will"

    Was anyone really not touched by this? Did anyone seriously believe this was "phoned in acting". If so I can only say "no soul, man...no soul..." ;-)
     
  2. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    I didn't dislike Back To Earth: I just found it disappointing. But, yes, I found that a very touching moment.

    It actually made me want to see Kochanski return at some point in the future just to see her and Lister together again. Before Back To Earth, I really didn't want the character to ever return, so the scene certainly had an impact on me.
     
  3. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    I didn't like most of Back To Eath. It had some good moments, to be sure. That was one of those fine moments, and said a lot about Craig Charles' growth as an actor. I don't actually remember blubbering like a baby, but I'm fairly sure I was impressed by that moment. It's encourgaging with regards the new series. I suppose I have this feeling that those who liked series 7 and 8 will be most likely to enjoy the new series, while those who didn't like the later series are probably not going to really enjoy any future dwarf. That's probably an oversimplified perception of things, though.

    I haven't seen BTE for some time, and may give it another watch. It's hard to be honest with myself whether I would have liked it if I'd never seen Red Dwarf before, if I could have seen it unbiased, just as a piece of science fiction comedy.
     
  4. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    I think 7 and 8 are like chalk and cheese in many respects and BTE is almost something else entirely. I think 8 is by far the worst series of the show but at the same time I really liked Back to Earth. I'd love to see future specials like this framing the regular comedy series...but that's just greedy I guess. :-)
     
  5. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    Curious, because series 7 is my least favourite, while I really liked series 8. I'm not sure whether I prefered BTE to series 7 or not! (Can we now get away with calling BTE series 9?) The bits in BTE that were good, I really liked. The Bladerunner references I really felt strongly were ill-used. The prodying of "geek" culture and Lister's emotional journey were done brilliantly, I felt. Some of the more obvious attempts at comedy were almost all poorly judged; from the off the long build-up to Lister's completely unamusing attempt to wind Rimmer up by ironing his sneezes into his trousers, the "laughing" skutter, the overly-long scene of them being attacked in the water tank while Rimmer was listening to "music," all failed to raise even a smile for me. That trend of attempts at humour that never seemed to come off continued throughout.

    Yet, little things like the nature of the hallucination, that it kept us guessing whether they would just find some way to re-enter the world of fiction, when really the world they were in was real after all, worked for me once I'd actually seen it through to the end. The way Cat kept making little squids (even though it was another Bladerunner reference) because his subconscious was trying to tell him something, I liked. Concept stuff like that, and Lister's last words to Kochanski, make me a lot more hopeful that the series still has new ground to cover. But then, there is that truly aweful slapstick silliness in the creator's room with the hoe. I know it was more parody; it was meant to be slapstick and silly because that was what Lister with his sense of humour and cultural background would write. But, like so much in BTE, it just didn't seem to work on film. If I'd read something like it in a Douglas Adams noval, I'd probably have found it very observant and funny.

    EDIT I hadn't meant to write that much. I don't think I've bothered to say as much on here about BTE before, and there's still stuff I would add.
     
  6. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    the lister/kochanski momment in BTE was a nice suprise and gave us something fresh and unexpected, but it seemed to be the only thing about the 3 parter that stands out in my mind

    while story wise BTE can be uncomfortable viewing due to the amount of self referencing and the amount of plot holes

    and it used the same plot device as back to reality, but it was also done better in back to reality as by the end you could see how the plot came together, while with BTE it left you wondering why a hallucination by the joy squid would leave them finding out they were part of a tv show where they have to track down the creator so they wont die
     
  7. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    Because the end result left them in a world in which they had total control over their own destinies, which would prevent them from wanting to leave. It's not a comfortable conclusion, I'll grant you, but I'm sure without too much brain-bashing we could come up with some far less easily resolved plot-quirks in Red Dwarf. Although, it's starting to get a bit dull now saying to people that Red Dwarf doesn't much care for consistencies, conclusion of cliffhangers or avoidance of plot-holes.:lol:
     
  8. GulDukat

    GulDukat Third Technician

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    A fine moment--one of the best in the series.
     
  9. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    It's strange, because part of me wanted to groan when Lister repeated what the kid said to dream-Kochanksi. It felt a bit corny... and yet it worked, and I found myself deeply touched as well. Overall, it was a very positive uplifting experience.

    Okay, maybe I shouldn't have answered, as I didn't dislike Back To Earth as a whole anyway. Curiously, I wasn't all that keen on those comedy moment Paul Taylor listed either. (Okay, I did like the squid bit, but I found Rimmer's dancing to dodgy music... well.. rather dodgy. The stuff in the background was amusing though. Interestingly I know many LOVE that bit. Just goes to show...)
     
  10. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    for me one of the worst scenes in red dwarf history as to be the crew looking at the DVDs and to their suprise about how they are just a tv show

    it was just arkward
     
  11. Diet_coke

    Diet_coke Science Officer

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    I thought it was good. not the best but good. back to earth.
     
  12. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    I found many moments in it felt awkward. It often felt almost as though they were waiting for the laugh, as they do in the series 7 episodes when played without a laughter track. Except, there was no laughter track. That was the kind of feeling I often got, anyway.

    Right, I've given enough of my opinion on Back To Earth. I'm actually really pleased that a lot of people liked it, and some have said they were inspired to watch Red Dwarf because of it.
     
  13. Number_58

    Number_58 Second Technician

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    Think I was too caught up in the wave of negativity to be touched by it since it was after Kochanski being blown out of an airlock. ;-) Certainly don't think the moment was phoned in. In retrospect and repeat viewings I appreciate it, but I care more when Lister's sitting in front of the memorial and his "I've been dead for ages, man" speech.

    I rate the closing moments of Stoke Me A Clipper and Rimmer reflecting in the observation dome (non-Remastered version) higher.
     
  14. squeal mold

    squeal mold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    i wasn't saddened by it, but i was saddened when i found out later in the episode that kochanski wasn't actually dead, now that was upsetting.
     
  15. yeckel

    yeckel Console Officer

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    I usually end up reading quite a bit and biting my tongue on this forum because I know how much goes into acting. All of the actors are wonderful and talented or the series would not have been so successful. I don't enjoy offering too many comments on what to change; knowing that if I wrote an episode it wouldn't be the show I enjoy. Everybody involved should just continue in their talented and awesome way. However, the scene just didn't do it for me. There wasn't any welling up! I spent most of it distracted by Kochanski's hair (the actress is so beautiful, why make those hair choices???). It may sound small and petty, but there it is. Was it a wig, or an insane amount of product? Maybe if Andrew has that one answered I can move on and watch it again. ;-)
     
  16. nicky_j

    nicky_j Deck Sergeant

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    I didn't understand what the hair was all about either. It must've been a wig because her hair was really long and blonde at DJ 2009. So why she had a bizarre wig on when she has such lovely hair I have no idea. I did find it very amusing though and I also found it distracted me from the rest of the scene :lol:
     
  17. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    It was all down to yet another Bladerunner reference. As with most such references in BTE, it was taken perhaps a little too far. If you haven't seen the end of Bladerunner, it probably would be a bit confusing.
     
  18. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    Much like a lot of BtE, the hairstyle is actually a Blade Runner reference. The character Rachel played by Sean Young, to be precise. It's understandable that you dislike the hair-style*, but that's the reason they took her that route. The hair styles are pretty much spot on for Rachel.

    *I actually found the frizzy thing in the last scene quite pretty, but I understand I might be well in the minority there. The other hair style is odd, but I think it's kind of meant to if seen in context with what we find out concerning Rachel in the Voight Kampff test. Highlight for spoiler: { Rachel is a replicant. An artificial life-form. }

    Edit. Oops. Beaten to it.
     
  19. nicky_j

    nicky_j Deck Sergeant

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    Ah that explains why I didn't get it, I've never seen Bladerunner. I keep meaning to watch it then parts of Back to Earth will make more sense.
     
  20. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    But, as usual, you were more informative.:-D

    Not much more, but yes, it would clear some things up. Plus, Bladerunner is a beautiful and profound movie.
     

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