RDXI Dwarf moments that make you morally uncomfortable

Discussion in 'RED DWARF XI / XII' started by R.I.P. 2000, Jul 5, 2017.

  1. One Time

    One Time Third Technician

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    Infinity Welcomes Careful Drivers mentions the advances
    S01E04 Waiting for God mentions she's a cripple
     
  2. BigOleMummy

    BigOleMummy Supply Officer

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    The only real "moral quandary" I've ever had with the show was the KKK patch Lister wore on his Knee for a episode. Been all through this on the "old" forum so don't really want to go through all that again but it still kinda rubs me the wrong way.
    Maybe I'm a little touchier about this than you all across the pond, ESPECIALLY in light of the political climate on our side of the pond but still........ I find myself more reluctant to view Series IV because of it.
     
  3. Abe but more Halloween themed

    Abe but more Halloween themed Deck Sergeant

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    Your part of the country even moreso, I'd imagine.
     
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  4. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    That was actually quite interesting. The original discussion is here. And the patch is all through Series V IIRC. The KKK don't exist outside America so it's understandable that Americans would be the ones to notice and get upset. No one else even knew what it was.
     
  5. BigOleMummy

    BigOleMummy Supply Officer

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    Abe ..... Yeah , Indiana (where I live now) had the highest membership in the KKK of the whole Country back in the 20's. Even today there are more active klan groups here than in MISSISSIPPI for smeg's sake! SMH. I know its not fair but it colors my perception of people I meet for the first time here. " I wonder............."

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century .... yeah I remember that thread, was fairly long if I remember correctly. (I haven't clicked on the link yet but probably will a little later.)

    And yes, I understand and can ............... understand .........up to a point that yes, it is a symbol of an AMERICAN TERRORIST group but still have trouble reconciling seeing it on my beloved Red Dwarf.
     
  6. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    Also, a lot of people view the KKK less as a contemporary terrorist organisation and more like a bigoted boy scouts. The historical KKK killed people in the early-mid 20th century, and I know that various little groups still exist around America calling themselves this-KKK or that-KKK, but what exactly do they do nowadays?

    To be honest, if the KKK-patch was already on the trousers and no one bothered to actually check what the symbols were, that's pretty incompetent. Surely that would be a standard practice. You can't just have your protagonist wearing symbols without checking what they are. Did someone not say "Hey, these trousers have a red and white cross with what looks like a drop of blood in the centre, maybe we should check what this is".

    There are mysteries either way. If it was already there, then where had those trousers come from? Or if Red Dwarf put it there on purpose, what were they thinking? That Lister was being ironic?
     
  7. BigOleMummy

    BigOleMummy Supply Officer

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    Their repulsive activities are still here and multiplying by the month here in the States:

    "Klan chapters grew from 72 in 2014 to 190 last year, invigorated by the 364 pro-Confederate battle flag rallies that took place after South Carolina took down the battle ..." as per the SPLC.

    Here's the article that came from : https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2016/year-hate-and-extremism

    That's from last year and its done nothing but rise and become more vocal since the trump coup. If you scroll down the page just a bit you can see pie charts denoting the percentages of hate group's here and they have the largest percentage by far.

    Here's another recent article on them, with a photo of a Terrorist wearing the robe with the symbol clearly visible : https://www.usnews.com/news/best-st...is-still-based-in-22-states-in-the-us-in-2017

    Here's another quick article/video :

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...lates-leaving-dark-corners-interne/418100001/ Video has clear picture of "man" wearing the symbol. Picture after video has "man" with symbol clearly emblazoned on his "shield". Hate and intimidation have no place in the modern world. These Terrorists are anything BUT "boy scouts".
     
  8. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    When I said "bigoted boy scouts" I meant that they have their meetings and their costumes and everything, but the most recent actual KKK murder was in 1981.

    Lister wore the patch in Series V, which was 1992. Obviously there was none of this tension in the US, let alone in the UK. I've mentioned before about how Red Dwarf has this big American influence all the time even though it's a British programme. In this case I think it was something that got lost in translation. Britons recognise the Confederate Flag mainly from Dukes of Hazzard, but the KKK symbol sailed past everyone.

    I'm quite fascinated by this whole thing, I don't tweet but someone should ask Doug privately (I doubt he'd want to draw attention to it!). Either the trousers came like that and no one bothered to check the symbols - in which case where the hell had those trousers come from - or someone involved in Red Dwarf put the symbol on - in which case why the hell.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  9. BigOleMummy

    BigOleMummy Supply Officer

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    Hence my "moral quandary". Not arguing with you at all, just saying. They don't have to murder someone per se but they sure promote the hatred and intolerance that leads to murder. Dylan Roof (less than a year ago). These Terrorists : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Byrd_Jr. 1998

    This : http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slat...ers_killed_at_least_60_in_u_s_since_1995.html

    I'll grant you that the AVERAGE person in the U.K. probably wouldn't know the symbol by sight, but a wardrobe person most certainly SHOULD. I'm assuming of course that the production company hired a professional. I'm further assuming that person has an education pertaining to film making/studies. (Film wardrobe/fashion) More assumption, a degree in film making would have at least one credit hour of film history. You cannot look into film history for more than a minute or two without encountering the name D.W. Griffith. An avowed white supremacist whose most famous film (and the grandfather of all modern movie techniques) was a glorification of the KKK, "Birth of a Nation". Whose robes and symbols were prominently displayed throughout practically the whole film. No excuse for anyone involved in film-making as a career to not know what this patch meant and means.
     
  10. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    It makes me morally uncomfortable that they left Hitler, Vlad, Stalin and Messalina to die.
     
  11. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    They were androids, so they would never die. If they were still running they could just live and do their thing in that science place. If they were powered down they'd be fine too ...
     
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  12. Dismembers

    Dismembers Deck Sergeant

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    I strongly suspect the dwarfers just left em, they have a notorious history of being quite callous with people/lifeforms dying/powering down. From ‘I’ve still got that library book’ to Confidence and Paranoia to the Cat Priest, Bexley, Me2 Rimmer, Wax Droids (ok Lister displayed some annoyance at that at least) the high versions of themselves, Legion, Knot, Irene E, the two lovers from Samsara, Herring and Bio Printed Rimmers.... and that’s not including any ‘enemies’ though I guess Legion kind of was.

    The only deaths they’ve expressed a bit of remorse over are Able and Ace Rimmer.

    They legged it without a thought for old Adolf and his gang.
     
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  13. Abe but more Halloween themed

    Abe but more Halloween themed Deck Sergeant

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    I'd like to point out that this thread isn't tagged for RDXII discussion.
     
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  14. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

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    Thanks Abe - I was on my phone and thought I was replying to a post in the dedicated episode thread.
     
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  15. Dismembers

    Dismembers Deck Sergeant

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    Whoops good call Abey.
     
  16. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    I checked the spoiler policy, it says "Once it has aired on Dave, it can be discussed in any thread in the "Red Dwarf XI/XI" conference".
     
  17. Dismembers

    Dismembers Deck Sergeant

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    Yeah Abe, stop being a Clam.
     
  18. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    I thought the sandstorm was going to destroy the planet or something to that effect. If not kill the droids, leave them adrift in space. Arguably even worse.
     
  19. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

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    There was a planetoid or a moon about to collide with the planet or something. The sandstorm was a separate (equally convenient) plot device to strand them there beforehand.
     
  20. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    Yeah, there you go. If the droids weren't pulverised by the collision, they're certainly in a pickle.
     

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