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Discussion in 'RED DWARF XI / XII' started by Seb, Oct 5, 2017.
Might have spoiled the plot if he’d buggered off to invade Poland.
A good Hitler obviously ;p
I thought it was utter pubes.
I didn't enjoy it. Sorry
And that too.
Now that made me laugh more than anything in the full 30mins of 'Cured'
I'm glad I'm not the only one who was underwhelmed. It seemed this was going to be yet another episode that everyone but me loves.
Honestly it was probably better paced then alot of the episodes from XI but for me it still suffered from a few issues that i felt could have been fixed with abit of editing.
Feel free to join me and the inevitable flood of newbies in my spin-off from the Explain That thread.
Okay, @sundayforsammy reminded me that the Explain That spin-off was in violation of the spoiler policy at present. Here's what I put:
I think there's a basic idea, in Cured, that sort of makes sense. The evil guy wants to hide in plain sight as the physician, so reprograms the actual physicians to be the patients. Then he puts himself and the supporting cast in cryo-sleep, programmed to wake up if a ship arrives, so he can fool any new arrivals.
So, here's a "that" which I'd like explaining.
Why did he dress them up as historical villains, and come up with an elaborate story - which is a complete fiction, remember - about reconstructing their DNA from their descendants? Why not have a cast of supporting characters who introduce themselves as contemporary serial killers, etc., that no one would have heard of?
If nothing else, it's a flagrant violation of ceteris paribus. The nature/nuture debate is an extra variable, throwing doubt on the whole experiment. If this were done for real, you'd challenge whether they'd really cured Hitler, or simply proved that a (potential) psycho is far less likely to be a murderous antisemitic dictator, if he grows up on a space station with a small number of 23rd Century role models - rather than having the real Hitler's formative experience.
Also, never mind the fact that Hitler doesn't look like Hitler - why are they all wearing their historical outfits? "We cloned you so we could try to cure you of your wicked ways. By the way - here's a costume to constantly remind you of your former life, which we're trying to help you put behind you." The costumes (and the rationale for the research) would have made more sense if the story involved villains being brought to the future through time travel - surely?
I was over-egging it in my initial response. I was underwhelmed by Twentica too, and would put this on a par with it, probably.
I did laugh at a few bits, namely:
- Numerous Hitler moments. Mostly just laughing at his delivery. E.g., the facial acting really sold the "because I'm Hitler" line. And I loved the visual gag of the dragon fruit.
- For some reason, I laughed at the look on Cat's face when he's pumping the thing to get Starbug off the ground.
- "Did it not seem strange that Hitler didn't look much like Hitler?" - there was a groan mixed in with the laugh, but I did like it.
Some of the lines seemed a bit clunky, and I even felt like there were a couple of moments where the cast half-stumbled over words?
I've having a mare at the minute - I accidentally posted the above text in the other (now deleted) thread. It's here now though.
Well, I found Cured pretty amusing. That is to say, I smiled and laughed, which is the important thing. It's hardly a classic. Will we ever again see an episode of Red Dwarf we consider a classic? Perhaps our memories of earlier series are to precious to us. Hitler didn't look like Hitler, obviously, but the actor who played him was brilliant, and gave us the best moments. I'm not sure I bought into the plot much, for the reasons @jmc2000 pointed out. There was no logic or reason to so elaborate a ruse. But it didn't matter, because even though I'm aware the seed of the plot was probably the thought of the Dwarfers having dinner with formally evil historical figures, and there are more rational ways to achieve that scene, it worked well for me. I accept clunky dialogue in the show these days because that seems to be how it is, but it's still Red Dwarf to me. The characters are still great, the science fiction elements are still mostly ridiculous but fun, and I'm convinced there is much enjoyment in store for series XII. On a first watch, I give it 7.25 out of 10.
What would everyone call this episode? Surely Cured can't be the optimal name?
Well 'Here No Evil' was much better in my opinion.
People are losing their minds as if Lister played the guitar well in this episode. Perhaps better than we've seen before, though haven't we only heard him play once? In Psirens? Seems like Hitler's guitars were in tune, at least, which certainly can't be said of Lister's guitar when we've heard it before.
If it really bothers you, still, think of it this way; in Psirens, Psiren Lister and normal Lister both play guitar and Psiren Lister plays the guitar perfectly. Normal Lister is completely delusional about the Psiren Lister playing better than him. When normal Lister plays, he hears something much better than everyone else. Perhaps we hear this (slightly) better performance with Hitler through their ears.
Either way, not one to lose sleep over.
What on earth was that song? Was that really the best song they could choose? I honestly can't think of a weirder song choice, lol.
It's a German song. I knew that much.
The tune was composed by a German, Friedrich-Wilhelm Möller, shortly after WWII!
Seems quite fitting with that in mind.
What's with you all whining about the guitar thing? It seemed clear enough to me that one guitar was really not too good and the other was jamming quite well. Either it was a recording where they were both supposed to be good that wasn't done very well or one where it was supposed to be one good and one bad that wasn't obvious.
It really bothered me how easy it was for them to get me to like Hitler when I still thought he was Hitler. And how there were only four evil figures. And how Joseph Stalin was lumped in with the rest - I personally believe he's got more redeeming qualities than the rest. But that might just be down to science man (still don't remember his name) just picking some people at random. But I really liked that it created the conflict where it makes you suddenly wonder if everybody you think is good is actually good or they just seem so because somebody tells you so, and same with bad.
But Vlad probably redeems all the lie points.
Except that we could have seen more of Vlad. But with 12 minutes cut, I can't believe they didn't mean for him to show up more.
It's my bedtime. Sorry for the incoherent blabber.