Episode 2 - Fathers and Suns

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by Urgamanix, Oct 11, 2012.

  1. simulant37

    simulant37 Science Officer

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    Was it really your "point"? You said "I was glad to see that Doug Naylor re-emerged on twitter today to address recent criticism of Red Dwarf." But then you said your "point" was that he didn't do so? How can you be "glad. . .that Doug Naylor re-emerged on twitter today to address recent criticism of Red Dwarf" if he didn't?!? Which was your "point" apparently?!? :roll:
     
  2. Smegged

    Smegged First Technician

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    The Medi-Bot certainly wouldn't be the most insane thing designed in the Red Dwarf universe. Triple buttocked GELFs? The Data Doctor? Space Corps directives instructing its fellows not to attempt oral sex in zero gravity if they have false teeth?

    I tend not to think to deeply on the motivations as to why things are funny in the RD World...I just accept that they are funny and good for a laugh.
     
  3. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    if they were gonna do the medi-bot it should have been a machine with a voice over similar to the ones in the bodysnatchers story because i think having another face on a screen who wasn't holly just made the ship seem more populated then it ever has before pre 1-6

    and you can say what about the data doctor in series 8? well that series was already populated so it wasnt that noticable
     
  4. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Also the Data Doctor stuck me just as being a program rather then being an actual AI
     
  5. Robert26

    Robert26 Second Technician

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    Interesting to note that on the two other forums I visit (digitalspy and galifreybase) most people have spoke positively of this episode and no one has even mentioned finding any of it offensive. Also there seems to be nothing on the major news sites about any kind of viewer complaints regarding the episode. Not saying it makes the episode any less controversial but the reaction seems to be limited to this fan board. Also the chinese whispers gag seems quite popular. A few of my friends have posted the "do chinese knickers have braces?" line on Facebook.
     
  6. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Another thing I loved about the episode and actually Naylor's direction is the fact that it really did create an illusion of the ship being massive with some creative shooting in the corridor sets......the corridor sets themselves were actually really impressive too and actually had quite an atmosphere to them, the best they have ever looked in Red Dwarf IMO.
     
  7. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Deck Sergeant

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    I didn't find the Chinese Whisper gag in anyway offensive or racist, I think its amazing how the western world has gone so PC about everything.
     
  8. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    Have you actually read the complaints on this and other Red Dwarf forums? They have little if anything to do with the "Chinese Whispers" running joke and everything to do with Taiwan Tony.

    Maybe you would be less "amazed" at how "the western world has gone PC" if you took the time to understand what people are actually offended by...or checked out the views on actual Red Dwarf fan sites like Ganymede and Titan where the exact same sentiments have been expressed by, I might add, completely different people.
     
  9. james3325

    james3325 Second Technician

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    yeah i agree people are way too sensitive
     
  10. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    simulant37 (and note I'm using your preferred formal name here as I'm being serious). I'm well aware that things like irony, implied humour and sarcasm can sometimes go over people's heads in the written form, but the number of occasions it seems to happen with you on this forum really should be a genuine cause of concern for you.
    You seem to approach everything that's written on here with such a literal, single minded fixed interpretation that it actually makes me worry about you.
     
  11. Smegged

    Smegged First Technician

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    As I said, I don't think too deeply on the motivations as to why things are funny. Why did they have a Medi-Bot, things seeming populated, etc., etc., etc...it doesn't really matter to me. I got a chuckle out of the Medi-Bot (if we're nitpicking, we've had plenty of dispensing machines/talking toasters/talking toilets etc. in the past). Who they chose to do the voiceover is somewhat immaterial to me - as long as it's funny, it's all good for me, and I found the guy to be humorous once he went all "Marathon Man" with his surgical mask.
     
  12. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    While I thought the Medi-bot and Dental-Bot* scenes were silly they didn't bother me. I had a little 'Pree' moment** in that I foresaw folk on the webs sites would complain about it though. I'm strongly coming to the conclusion that the fan-base of Red Dwarf doesn't really go for silly humour all that much. To be fair, I don't either, generally speaking, but some things will tickle me. Not so much the medi-bot (although I found the dentist version amusing. Sick programmers. ;-) ) but, as I said, I wasn't really fussed.


    *Who I didn't even realise were meant to be separate characters until reading that on here or G&T.

    ** In the prescient sense I mean. My cleavage didn't suddenly expand.
     
  13. simulant37

    simulant37 Science Officer

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    Wrong. I'm not being "literal" or "Single minded". You said what you said, & then tried to change what you meant. As my response clearly demonstrated. Just be clearer really. Although I thank you for your concern. :roll:
     
  14. simulant37

    simulant37 Science Officer

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    The western world hasn't gone PC about everything. Its just most of us don't like stereotypical racist representations of ethnic groups, even for comedy purposes!

    PS - its not the Chinese Whisper gag its actually the Taiwan Tony character. Why get a western actor to portray the character in such an old fashioned offensive way. What next, an actor blacking up? :roll:
     
  15. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    But I haven't changed what I meant. You don't get to determine that for me with your response, only I do by my words.
    You missed the obvious sarcasm in my post and still seem to be missing it, much like you seem to miss a lot of people's attempts at humour and sarcasm around here when you try to correct them with a literal interpretation of what they wrote.
    Is it all of us, or is it you, do you think?
    I do try to be more literal when I reply to you because I've observed that sarcasm is something you don't seem to pick up on but in this instance I was talking to the forum in general, most of whom, I assume, got my drift.

    All that tot aside though I do agree with you here. People are misunderstanding the core of what has annoyed people about this. Andrew has stated on Twitter that its similar to the crew "walking up to a white actor in yellowface and, in all seriousness, asking them about political correctness." ..I'm pretty sure Doug wouldn't have touched that with a barge poll so it should have been enough to give him second thoughts about Taiwan Tony.
     
  16. Robert26

    Robert26 Second Technician

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    Not meaning to start any kind of debate or arguments but I wonder what your thoughts on the following are:
    1.The Indian guy in the Simpsons
    2.The highly rated classic Dr Who story The Talons of Weng Chiang
     
  17. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Deck Sergeant

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    First of all I was replying to a post which in the words of the poster said "A few of my friends have posted the "do chinese knickers have braces?"
    So my reply to THIS post was 100% about the chinese whispers gag.

    I live and work in a big multi racial area and do understand what people are, and are not offended by and it's not as simple as that.

    If you have been offended by the TT part then ok, you have been offended, but to be honest I find some of your dialogue to people very rude and directly offensive.


    eg. this is one of your replies to another poster.


    Based on the total ignorance displayed in your belief in this Daily Mail fairytale I'm not even going to bother reading the rest of your reply but I will say this: Thank you for completely validating my point just made about what kind of people would find Taiwan Tony funny.
     
  18. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    I'll give you a much more relevant example of the Simpsons showing a racist caricature and perfectly conveying its message about the feelings of the creator:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vg7_gaVUd0&feature=related

    Now that clip illustrates its point very clearly. The stunned silence, the horrified reaction by the crowd. It's highly likely that the TV audience watching are laughing but it's VERY clear that the object of humour is Krusty's stupidity and ignorance.
    In F&S were given a similar artifact (thankfully toned down by the fact its a vending machine) yet its left very unclear what the message is and what the studio audience are laughing at.

    As for the Doctor Who episode, I haven't seen it so can't really comment but google reveals it was made in the 1970's. Something that means it shouldn't really need any further discussion.
     
  19. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    And my reply was to both comments, neither of which seemed to understand what it was that had caused offense in the first place: Taiwan Tony not the Chinese Whispers subplot in general.

    And I stand by them. Strong as they are. Certainly they are in line with those chosen by the person I was debating with who chose to refer to me as a "Brainwashed, self-agrandising liberal" amongst other things :lol:.
    I wonder why you are dredging this up again? I haven't attacked you, merely corrected you on what the object of offense here is.
     
  20. dodgebizkit

    dodgebizkit Deck Sergeant

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    If the Thai food machine had had an English accent. you'd have found it racist that they wouldn't bother to represent the Thai people with their accent being used. A real Thai accent would have got the same negative reaction but less laughs, and not have made the point that the joke was written to make though failed to deliver to many people.

    Damned if you do, damned if you post here.

    Just don't be so P.C, none of my Asian friends were offended by it, just a few white (I assume) English guys on a web forum getting offended on their behalf because they seem to think/have been conditioned to think that they will seem racist if they don't.

    I'm surprised they even saw the episode and were't all drinking tea on the patio with English Edward... Oops, I just offended a Thai reader with that comment :S
     

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