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Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by dodgebizkit, Oct 24, 2012.
3. Fathers and Suns
3. Fathers & Suns
Was there something you wanted to say, MacabreMagpie?
What you recall may differ from what was said. The date, too, might not be the same one you remember. And we can find it. The site's search facility's easy to use...especially if you have a genuine recollection of what was said. Back it up.
It worries me that you're conflating several responses into one - but also that you recall me saying that I had to "make notes on the scripts to stop [the fast pace] becoming an even bigger problem."
If you can show me where I ever said fast pace was a problem that could become even worse without my intervention, I'll happily retract. But I'm sure that's another loaded rebranding of what was actually said.
However, in that previous link I provided I did say this:
Which has much of the flavour of what you suggest I said...but none of the implications you give it.
Anyway, there it is. I say I didn't say that, I'm being misrepresented, and the response is "I wasn't talking about that quote, you said it in another one".
I shall now recuse myself. Thanks for reading. And a big flirty wink to Freeborn.
You know the comments about the Blackadder style humour even appeared in this episode when the Chief of the BEGG's was saying he wanted Rimmer for his sexy womanlike legs.
Why should we do that?
Are you so unwilling to accept that you may have been mistaken about something?
The Dwarfers clearly didn't "need them to die". Explain to me in what way you thought they did? If you're handcuffed to a ticking bomb you clearly don't want the only person who you think can unlock it to die. Having them die only made the task of getting Lister out of the exploder even more difficult.
Honestly I can understand opting to disagree over an abstract theory but I don't see how you can keep on disagreeing over something against all logic. If you can explain why they "needed them to die" then I'd love to hear this explanation.
Otherwise it seems like you're just unwilling to accept you made a mistake. If people are ging to accuse Doug (again) of ripping off one of his old plots (in this case the luck virus) then they need to actually be able to back it up, it can't be based on a (willful?) misinterpretation of the plot.
So far my RDX order is:
4. Fathers & Suns
I love how everybody has different orders. It shows how diverse Red Dwarf fandom is, and how all fans are looking for something different from this series.
I agree Dan, I think one of the reasons there is such a diversity in what people like best has a lot to do with how long Red Dwarf has been running and peoples ages. For instance the very first series my nephew saw of Red Dwarf was series VII, so when I lent him my DVD collection to watch the rest he seen the eariler episodes as slow and possibly would miss a lot of the jokes, Wheras I'm old enough to have seen all the series as they aired so prefer the earlier style.
what I'm trying to say really is that there will be people who prefer the eariler bunk room scene type stuff and others who will prefer the faster paced stuff of later series. In the end were all Red Dwarf fans though so each to there own.
I may switch Trojan and Entangled, at 1 and 2 respectively. I've only seen Entangled twice, whereas I've seen Trojan about 10, 15 times (I don't have a lot to do).
I think the diversity of the love for Red Dwarf is one of its major charms. There's something for everyone, and very few TV shows can claim that.
i think doug may be trying to hard to write clever plots to the point they become abit flat or confusing
fathers and suns had 3 subplots that came together at the end but one fell flat i feel personally, and entangled has a plot that has the most confusing logic i think red dwarf may have ever had
i mean if you look at gunmen of the apocalypse it didn't need several subplot or a set up that comes together at the end or even confusing logic, it was all pretty straight forward and is one of the best red dwarf episodes to date
Okay, here's the order I'd put the episodes in:
1. Fathers And Suns
Am I the only person who would put Entangled last? lol :P
I think it was less straightforward than it looked, in fairness.
You had what at first appeared to be a throwaway opening scene with the AR machine, then a part involving simulants and a bit of a space battle, then the threat shifted away from Simulants as Starbug became infected with a virus and started heading towards a sun. You then have a situation where Kryten has a weird wild west dream and the crew conveniently have a wild west AR game that they can use to plug into his dream and go and help him via the AR machine introduced right back at the outset.
It's definately not a straightforward story and I wonder, if it was screened today whether people would pick holes in its easy enough to follow but rather strung together logic. I just get the sense that there is a crowd of people who watch Red Dwarf these days with a certain sense of joylessness and would have found just as many things to complain about in the original show if they were analysing them in as much detail instead of just watching them and enjoying them as most of us did as kids.
4. Fathers and Suns
Thought this episode was good and bad. The plot was decent enough although it seemed to drag on and fizzled out at the end. No climax to Lister having the groinal exploder on just an overly drawn out gag with the same joke about the woman making wrong decisions. Which was actually done better earlier on when she was a terrible judge of character with Rimmer and of Lister's guitar playing prowess. Then the final scene - she dies...and no one really cares. I mean Lister was more arsed when his imaginary Confidence killed his imaginary Paranoia than possibly the only other human being in the Universe.
Ok but I enjoyed Lister with the kebab. Another classic Lister moment. Kryten explaining about the coming together of people who get everything wrong paid off. Rimmer thinking Lister was turning over a new leaf. Cat had his moments (his cv thing). I think the plot needlessly strayed away from Lister playing Poker with the garbage guys. I think it would have been funny to see them have a rematch. Maybe cheat and win, get caught and leg it. Simple. I dunno. Something is missing somewhere. First two episodes had the best plots. Lemons wasnt great in that department and this one lacked a bit of direction too. I have some overall issues with Rimmer this season but I'll save them for his thread.
I should say that I didn't find Entangled that hard to follow......it was a wibbly wobbly plot but it's hardly a first time Red Dwarf has been and it's a part of the show's charm.
well if you look at entangled we the cat and kryten thing where it isn't fully explained if cat and kryten are making these coincidences happen or if they are just more aware early that they are about to happen as kryten gives the explanation that these coincidences were always gonna happen anyway which means all 4 of the beggs were always gonna choke all at once anyway? which would be incredibly silly if thats the case but if kryten and cat made it happen similar to the luck virus it probably would be more understandable but thats not quite what kryten explains it
then you have a space station that is always wrong which is similar to justice but you have rimmer saying how he feels at home there and thankfully im not the only person who didn't quite get the meaning of that gag and even now i still think its abit silly then at the end you have the entangled stuff mixed with the wrong stuff which you can take it as it comes as long as you don't think about it to much
but if you compare it to gunmen of the apocalypse which has what bad ass android dudes, space battle, a computer virus and virtual reality which is all basic sci-fi stuff
But why did the Sim's fix the squeak in the seat tilt control?
because the sims were entangled and coincidence fixed the chair duh! not that the chair wasnt gonna fix itself anyway but it just happened to happen at that moment because the sims were around...
Either that or they just hate squeeky chairs