RDXII EPISODE 4 - MECHOCRACY - DISCUSSION THREAD

Discussion in 'RED DWARF XI / XII' started by Seb, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. Pembers

    Pembers Deck Sergeant

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    One small thing I would have liked to see, particularly considering the call backs in this episode, is a couple of brief cameos from other vending machines we ‘know’ like Snacky, Taiwan Tony (everyone’s favourite) and maybe the Medi/Denti Bot.

    Even if we just saw glimpses of them in the background, an Easter Egg type thing.
     
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  2. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    While I wouldn't have minded a cameo by Snacky (he was a delightful character), I'm glad we never saw Taiwan Tony and the Medibot......they are the things that really dragged down Fathers and Suns, and they would have only dragged this episode down too!
     
  3. SweatyChimpBoy

    SweatyChimpBoy Second Technician

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    Agreed, Taiwan tony was annoying as was the medibot. Talkie was great though
     
  4. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    Only from the universe's point of view. From the Dwarfers' dimension-hopping perspective - on their "personal timeline" - it's happened twice.

    If they killed Hitler, then dimension-jumped to a different reality and killed him there, I think it'd be natural for them to say they'd killed him twice - even though a given universe would only recognise one of the two events?
     
  5. dazsin

    dazsin First Technician

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    So far my order of favourite episodes of Series XII would be 3, 4, 1, 2 . I have enjoyed them all though, a great series, really looking forward to the last two episodes! Hoping a Series XIII gets commissioned ASAP - sounds like it's doing really well in the ratings so we can hope!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
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  6. Chris D

    Chris D Engineer

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    Can a Hologram kill itself? IMO that rules out Out of Time.

    So then that means it's either Timeslides or Only the Good.

    Personally, I think Timeslides would be a rather obscure back reference. Though whatever it truly refers to is almost certainly very deliberately ambiguous and I can imagine Doug laughing about that.
     
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  7. Chris D

    Chris D Engineer

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    This episode was brilliant. Actually up there among my favourite RD episodes and now actually very close to being the best episode in Series XI and XII. I need to re-watch Give and Take and Mechocracy to figure out which is best. Anyway, my rank so far for this season:
    1. Mechocracy
    2. Cured
    3. Timewave
    4. Siliconia
     
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  8. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    Yes and I don't remember any episode similar to where the crew are fighting among themselves in an election campaign to become machine president.

    Balance of power is close but even then wasn't quite as silly as modern dwarf.

    Its a plot that requires things to get abit goofy in order to believe the crew would individually even care about doing any of it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  9. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    I think the plot while a bit goofy (shocking from a comedy, huh?) did give a sold enough reason, the machines realising they hold all the cards to and rebelling when the crew disregard their survival. While modern Red Dwarf is a little bit sillier then it maybe was in season 1 and 2.....it never veered into series 8 pantomime like last weeks disaster did, not even close. While you're entitled to feel how you do about it, I feel this was a witty and well constructed episode that took an atypical idea for the show, and made it feel distinctively Red Dwarfy.

    I can't help but feel that the biggest issue you have is that modern Red Dwarf doesn't feel exactly like an extention of the style it left off with at series 6. Realistically it was never going to though, series 7 and 8 were never going to unhappen, Rob Grant is gone, and Doug himself would be I different place now compared to where he was 2 and a half decades ago. While it's not an exactly the same, I feel this episode was a strong one and anything but a shadow of its former self........now if we were talking about last weeks episode, I would full heartedly agree with you!
     
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  10. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    It could be argued i been spoilt by early 1-6 Dwarf where if you compare it to todays Red Dwarf the quality drop in many areas is noticable and some of it is covered up by abit more sillyness because as you say its a comedy.

    Its like looking at an episode like bodyswap back in 1989 as i can tell that if we got bodyswap today it could be abit more sillier, like cat and kryten would probably have their own debate similar to rimmer and listers and decide to body swap with each other and then the concept would get abit more goofy with all 4 in each others bodies ect ect

    mechocracy was basically machines go on strike, Rimmer just wants to be in charge of anything and everything, lister wants to spite rimmer, kryten... i dunno, and cat is blackmailed

    I miss the Quality balance that the early shows had where it didn't get too silly, it knew the right pace for the jokes, didn't feel the need to bring up past episodes often and the characters felt oddly more fleshed out and less caricaturish then they do today.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  11. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Actually I think there was far more to Lister and Kryten's motivations then you claim. Kryten being a mech himself felt he understood where Machines are coming from and felt that because they're sentient, they deserve the rights they demand. Lister did it for more then spite, he knew Kryten would keep the balance of order because he knows he isn't corrupt and overtly ambitious for power like Rimmer is. I mean you are simplifying what actually happened in this episode a lot.

    Just because this episode was a bit sillier then what we would have gotten nearly 30 years ago, doesn't it itself make it a worse episode. I actually found the jokes in this episode very strong, and the script itself very tight. I honestly didn't think the characters did act like caricatures of themselves here, but rather it was the situation itself was goofier then early seasons.

    On top of that, there are episodes of Classic Red Dwarf that were goofier....Backwards, Polymorph, Timeslides, Meltdown and Emohawk were all far sillier then this episode was. On top of that I would argue even Legion was.....people seem to largely forget how slapsticky that episode was!
     
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  12. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    In terms of tone lets look at Meltdown yes the concept is silly but the way it was handled was far less silly then it could have been.

    You didn't have the characters portraying goofy versions of historical figures, infact apart from Elvis there wasn't alot of laughs from the guest stars or even the outcome or climax of the episode.

    Today if that episode was done... i dunno.

    Although Meltdown is probably one of my least favourite episodes of the original run and that isn't because its silly, its more because the concept just never really gripped me.
     
  13. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Are you kidding? Anyone who got lines in this episode hammed it up like you wouldn't believe. Of all the historical figures, Elvis was the one who got the most time, Tony Hawks was very hammy as Caligula, and the worst offender by far was the guy who played Laurel who made me cringe while watching. Let's also not forget that Meltdown holds the broadest preformance by Chris Barry outside of series 8.

    ......I do agree it's one of the weakest classic episodes, only slightly better then Emohawk!

    If anything I found this episode far more reserved!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  14. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    But would they even know about the dimension where still-alive-Rimmer blew himself up? We just had a scene where Rimmer isn't a hologram and he blows himself up. Only that-dimension's Holly saw it. We don't know what happened, maybe Holly fixed the timeline and subsequently told them all.
     
  15. Matthew Polson

    Matthew Polson Third Technician

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    Talkie Toaster returns!! So glad to see him again after all these series!!
     
  16. Rageofangels

    Rageofangels First Technician

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    I agree with your rank, as that's how I see it, although I think Mechocracy and Cured are equally as good as each other.
     
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  17. Trauntrian

    Trauntrian Third Technician

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    Other than the position of Siliconia, I'd agree

    Mechocracy was better than Cured which in turn was better than Timewave, but I think Siliconia is in the middle somewhere - better than Timewave, not as good as Mechocracy, on an equal standing with Cured
     
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  18. Cloud

    Cloud Console Officer

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    I really liked that episode. Was good fun.
     
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  19. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    Really loved the episode, but sadly couldn't catch a lot of the things Cat and Lister say in the end scene for some reason. I got Cat trying to tell about the glasses, but not how/why Rimmer was locked in with Talkie in the end scene ...
     
  20. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Cat locked him in there.....my assumption is that he was told to get Talkie out of the Garbage hold, and Cat locked the door behind him....but that I see me speculating because they never really state that.
     

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