RDXII EPISODE 4 - MECHOCRACY - DISCUSSION THREAD

Discussion in 'RED DWARF XI / XII' started by Seb, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    That was a good episode! The manipulation gag at the start was particularly amusing, although I do wonder why Rimmer would agree to do the cleaning. Then again he is quite a 'by the book' character at times and maybe he secretly likes it after his time doing the same thing as a Mechanoid.

    While I've thought they might be referencing the past a bit too much this series, I liked the way they did it here. It made sense, and it was funny.

    As for Rimmer dying twice, I saw this as a Timeslides reference as well. Okay, technically Rimmer only died once, just at different times depending on the time line. However, after the time line changed, Rimmer still retained his memory of the original time line, as he expressed surprise that he was no longer a hologram, so from his POV, he experiences both deaths. Maybe the others remembered the original time line too, or he just told them about it later.

    I'm not sure why they would remember. Maybe this is an earlier example of what Lister speaks about in his confusing monologue at the start of series 7, ie. a new universe being spawned to deal with the paradox with elements of both differing timelines.

    In the end, which was we're probably over thinking it though. It's just meant to be a gag.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
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  2. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    Thank you. That was the only thing I thought odd. Kryten winning the election and no remark or appearance from Rimmer until the end. I thought it was explained in the bits I couldn't hear :-)
     
  3. Chris D

    Chris D Engineer

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    I forgot to mention this in my comments earlier.

    I think that gag was a stroke of genius. I was starting to think "Hmm, well, that went on a bit long for the pay off simply to be a menial task being delegated to Rimmer. I don't think people will like that gag, not sure if I even like it...".

    Then Lister came along and revealed it was actually about manipulation all along and I just thought that was brilliant.

    The simple answer as to why Rimmer would agree to do the cleaning is simply that Kryten masterfully manipulated him into doing it, and I'm not sure it needs more of an explanation than that. Excellent.
     
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  4. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    I think the references in this season are on purpose as next year is the 30th anniversary and Doug took that into account when writing this. Doctor Who did the same in the year of the 50th :-)
     
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  5. Cloud

    Cloud Console Officer

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    I particularly liked the use of old clips in the smear videos. also the Rimmer killing himself twice part was interesting.
     
  6. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    The references have been a thing for a while now.

    Its one of the things that hurt back to earth for alot of people because Doug did all that back referencing for series 8 and then when he did BTE he did it more with the excuse that it was an anniversary special but no one who watched it see it that way because the back references were nothing new.

    If i had to guess i think Doug does it because he thinks they are cool to reflect on but it makes time feel so compact when in timewave for example Rimmer talks about killing the crew and then later in the episode lister also brings it up like Doug seems to feel its something worth reflecting on over and over.

    It would be nice if Doug reflected on events we didn't know rather then finding new ways for Rimmer to talk about those same events.
     
  7. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    You know, after Timewave it feels so good to be positive about an episode again. As much as it might have looked like I was getting off on criticising akin to Johnny Vegas, I really don't like being negative to this show.....I want to like it. Thankfully this episode really brought me back into a good mood about the show, and I'm glad of that. I think maybe if we do get more episodes, I hope they commission them one episode at a time. I feel like if they combined the best of this series with the best of last, we would have had a very solid 6 episode block!
     
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  8. Underdunn

    Underdunn First Technician

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    Agreed! The audience got double-bluffed as much as Rimmer himself! In fact even before they revealed the bluff, just the sight of Rimmer casually mopping away (obliviously pleased with himself for being such a great teacher!) made me laugh!

    Just a positive, joyful, fun episode all round - without a hint of mean-spiritedness in sight. I've missed these sort of episodes a lot! :thumbup:
     
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  9. Cloud

    Cloud Console Officer

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    I kind of want to watch it again. I only watched it a few hours ago. Compared to Timewave which I havn't really given a second thought to I would quite like to watch this again.
     
  10. jaybo1973

    jaybo1973 Catering Officer

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    Hi all
    I had to come on here and comment on this episode. This is the first episode since the classic era (up to series 6) that has really felt like red dwarf. I have enjoyed X to present at times, (apart from last week), but this was a return to fame. All the supporting cast and locations are over done now. Back to basics. Brill!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
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  11. Dwarfer_Stu

    Dwarfer_Stu Second Technician

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    Here! *points down*
    This was a very noticable increase in quality from last week. More than a few laugh-out-loud moments from me!
     
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  12. johnjdc

    johnjdc Skutter

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    I thought this was very good. I was certain that at the end it would be revealed that the whole virus and strike were set up by Kryten as further homework for his manipulation class, though.
     
  13. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    It took a while to get going, but when it did it was wonderful. It felt like the kind of episode that could easily have fit into season IV. I just felt it was lacking a few more really funny lines.

    Various thoughts:
    • What a beautiful external shot with Red Dwarf and the blue and red planets that appears at 3:14. Makes a great desktop background too.
    • What does PD stand for? They used that abbreviation in season 2 as well.
    • Nice to see Rimmer and Cat getting a few scenes together. It doesn't happen often.
    • I recognised most of the Kryten clips from previous episodes, but where on earth was the first one from where he's pulling an odd un-Kryten-like facial expression? And that shot of the skeletons - that's not from an episode, is it? Why didn't they just use a shot from the episode Kryten since that's what they were referencing?
    • Rimmer killed himself twice? We all know the first time, but when was the second?
    • Talkie Toaster! What a great surprise, and I'm glad it wasn't spoiled like the way another character's return later this season was. Welcome back to Red Dwarf after 26 years, David Ross. You were a terrible Kryten but I wouldn't have anyone else voicing Talkie.
    Funniest line:
    Lister: "When you prick us, don't we all say, 'Smegging hell, you pricked me, you smegger!'"

    Overall: After three episodes featuring other locations and guest characters, Mechocracy reminds us how good the show can be when it's just the main cast aboard Red Dwarf.

    Rating: 8.5/10
     
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  14. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    Periodic Detention is what it usually stands for.
    Those events happened aboard the Nova 5. Red Dwarf probably doesn't have CCTV footage of them.
     
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  15. Underdunn

    Underdunn First Technician

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    The more practical explanation is probably that any shot featuring the skeletons in that episode also features a completely different actor playing Kryten!
     
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  16. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    I'm sure there are shots of the skeletons without Kryten. But that's an out-universe concern. In-universe, the footage screamed "Explain That?" because how did they happen to have footage of events aboard ship. Obviously our audience POV is some sort of CCTV and everything we see is what the CCTV is seeing. Which helpfully explains why we sometimes see cameras in-shot.
     
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  17. Ant E

    Ant E Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Ok.

    I always thought it was “paint duty”!!

    Yes
    Wasn’t it Camille? Also, wrong actor playing Kryten in “Kryten” so would look a bit weird

    Well, technically it could be closer to four if we’re being picky:
    1. Radiation leak (we know this one as it made him a hologram)
    2. Died after getting blown up in Timeslides
    3. Died in Out of Time
    4. Possibly died at the end of Only the good?!

    Oh yes. Mod Bluey doesn’t like the episode Kryten...
    But I agree - i was pleased to see Talkie again!

    REVIEW OF BLUEY’S REVIEW
    Mildly picky, lacking a few basic bits of RD knowledge. Otherwise fine. Suggest watching more series 4 for future reference. Review rating 7.5 out 10
     
  18. Underdunn

    Underdunn First Technician

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    Easy peasy lemon squeezy!!! Kryten was onboard the derelict Nova5 for Y-E-A-R-S! Happily going about his business looking after his dead crew-mates without ever apparently noticing them in a state of decay. You think he never made a couple of cheerful home movies with them all whilst he was there? Pfffft! Course he did! In fact he's probably got an old photo album full of their skeletal pictures somewhere onboard Red Dwarf as well... And that's before we ever get into a discussion on whether Kryten himself can recall, playback and upload his own memories onto film! The in-universe explanations for there being footage of the skeletons is almost endless!
     
  19. Underdunn

    Underdunn First Technician

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    Actually, was there any footage from 1 & 2 at all? Because that was pre Grant-Naylor productions wasn’t it? So they’d have needed permission from PJP productions or whoever to use it
     
  20. Ant E

    Ant E Flight Co-Ordinator

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    No. They bought the rights and formed Grant Naylor on series 4
     

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