RDXII EPISODE 6 - SKIPPER - DISCUSSION THREAD

Discussion in 'RED DWARF XI / XII' started by Seb, Nov 8, 2017.

  1. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

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    I don't understand why recurring characters are derided as "callbacks". Recurring characters are pretty normal things in television programmes. When Kryten reappeared in Backwards, did people complain that it was a callback to Kryten?
     
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  2. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    On the subject of callbacks. This was the third episode this season to reference the Om song.

    If you're not sure where then have a listen to what the monks are chanting during the sacrifice...
     
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  3. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    That one doesn't bug me so much as it's subtle, even though I didn't find the cultists universe overly funny. It doesn't feel as forced as it's reference in Timewave (though pretty much nothing was good in that episode), it is odd to think half the episodes reference that one song.....I mean why not go for something less obvious like the "Kindling" song for confidence and paranoia?
     
  4. Callisto252

    Callisto252 Supply Officer

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    Yes, and he was in the costume. In fact, he gave away a little hint of this in the interview with James Buckley - watch from about 12 minutes in, where they're describing the series in three words:

     
  5. DAN_JMC

    DAN_JMC Catering Officer

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    no, but repeating scenes from previous shows are
     
  6. misterjohnsparks

    misterjohnsparks Second Technician

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    It was pretty decent, some good humour and character moments. I just feel they should have made it a little deeper. Maybe been a little more poignant on the characters' reflecting on their pasts - have Rimmer take something away with him when he returns to our universe.

    Strange series overall. We saw Red Dwarf at its worst and best over six episodes, but thoroughly enjoyed the run. I'd have it sit somewhere between series six and seven in terms of quality (six being my least favourite of the Doug/Rob run).
     
  7. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    Regarding 'Star knot' was it originally conceived as a play on the word "not". Given how much the Dwarfers rely on saying they are NOT going to do something in the first half?
     
  8. SweatyChimpBoy

    SweatyChimpBoy Second Technician

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    Just watched this afew more times and it's gone up in my estimation. Afew things i particularly enjoyed was the Cat and Lister exchange with the Cat doing everything Lister wants.
    I thought holly was brilliant, just like Season 1 and 2 Holly, deadpan and hilarious.
    Also loved Captain Lister, very funny.
     
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  9. redwinnie

    redwinnie Skutter

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    I just have to say I loved the latest episode. Possibly more than any of the new ones over the last few years. The references back to the old episodes had me crying with a combination of laughter and nostalgia.

    I have to say one thing though. For all the people complaining about red dwarf repeating scenes and jokes. One thing it has never done, unlike a lot of other sitcom/comedies is flash back episodes. Think friends and How I met your mother. Whole episodes of just reused footage hashed together to make an episode. SO think yourself lucky its just a few jokes.
     
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  10. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    I wish I loved this episode as much as you guys, I really do. However while the trip down memory lane is cute, it just felt like a kinda hollow episode. I enjoyed it and the 7 I gave it I stand by......but it's a low 7. Only it was the second half of the episode that largely fell flat for me, as the first half felt like it was building into a more interesting (and more funny) episode then it ended up being. Another thing that struck me too is that I felt Chris Barrie's performance was a little off this time too.....kinda like how he was in the first few series X episodes, and for a Rimmer based episode that's a problem.

    Honestly the one thing that pushes this episode above a high 5 or low 6 for me is that scene where Lister is exploiting the fact that Cat doesn't get how everything he decides to do, he does the opposite. That scene was comedic gold and might even be the funniest comedy set piece in the entire Dave era. To be fair Holly was a breath of fresh air after how rubbish he was in series 8. However I just which this all added upto an episode that had more substance!
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 10:25 AM
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  11. Underdunn

    Underdunn First Technician

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    I've found myself wondering how much more effective the episode would have been if it had been Lister doing the skipping rather than Rimmer. Perhaps instead of volunteering to skip, he'd started doing it accidentally and couldn't find his way back again... and perhaps he had wound up leaving the Dwarfers from his universe in grave peril when he did.

    I just think that ending with Earth in the window would have been so much more poignant if it was Lister being confronted with it rather than Rimmer... Earth is after all his ultimate dream, much more so than it was ever Rimmers. The idea of him being presented with everything he'd ever craved and choosing to continue skipping anyway because he couldn't leave his old crew mates in danger would really been effective I think. Very Quantum Leap, I know, but then this whole episode was anyway!

    I'm not entirely sure why Doug often seems to focus on Rimmer for finales. Lister to my mind is the hero of this show and he carries much more emotional currency for a finale than Rimmer does.
     
  12. Chris D

    Chris D Engineer

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    I had a theory before it aired that the episode could have been used to explain the series VIII cliffhanger somehow, explain which Rimmer we have now and how the ship was saved from the microbe and what ultimately he did which was so brave to save the day (as was alluded to in "The Beginning").

    Then the answer to the question of which universe contains the Rimmer which isn't so much of a loser, is the one he came from!
     
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  13. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    Although it's obvious why they wanted to record Skipper last, I feel it should have been recorded earlier, Chris was beyond exhausted at that point and this episode was very demanding with all it's costume changes and different scenes ... Despite this, he did really well.
     
  14. RainbowGazelle

    RainbowGazelle Second Technician

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    Only American shows do that.
     
  15. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    I seem to recall hearing how around this time he was in pain from having a hernia too.
     
  16. DivineVarod

    DivineVarod Catering Officer

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    True, it's noticeable he's not that well in offstage pics, and some fans mentioned it in reports. And he'd already had that wallop from the Kryten episode.
     
  17. Today's Fish...

    Today's Fish... Third Technician

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    Apologies if this has already been spotted and mentioned, but I'm just watching XII again from the beginning, and I only just noticed from the opening scene of Cured that the series as a whole begins and ends with them playing cards for matchsticks. A nice touch. Series XII - the Ouroboros series...
     
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  18. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    I really liked this episode. I thought the start scene between Cat and Lister especially funny. Very reminiscent of that wonderful scene in White Hole, but used in a very different way.

    The rest of the episode was fine, although I would have liked a bit more time were spent with Rimmer, um, skipping. (What an image that puts in my head. "We're off to see the wizard... " Never mind.) The universe that Rimmer first encounters puzzled me a bit, as it seemed to be just their own universe, between Lister's incarceration and the death of the crew, so more time travel than dimensional. But as a few of you have pointed out, Rimmer is a hologram in this alternate timeline, so there's the difference right there. I confess the ramifications of this didn't occur to me on first viewing, I was just thinking it was cool to see him back in the old gear with a series 1 style 'H'. I guess in this universe he died and the Welsh chap stayed alive, since I'd imagine the other chap would be considered more vital to the crew.

    Thinking about it, the rules of this particular version of universe hopping were established right at the start with the original gag with Cat and Lister, i.e. when they entered the timeline where the opposite decision was made, they didn't meet the alternate selves that made the other decision. They BECAME them, although their own memory had right of veto. The skipper device, working properly, took Rimmer to timelines that had splintered further back, but that does not mean that rule does not still apply, as shown by Rimmer taking Holly's place, at one point, and later becoming human, etc.* I suspect if Rimmer crossed into the universe with human counterparts, using the skipping device,he would find himself as Arlene.

    As for him not encountering Ace, well the last Ace we know of, was actually him, if you think back to Stoke me a Clipper. (Depending on what version of Rimmer this is.) I'm kind of glad he didn't encounter him, but it would have been nice if he had been mentioned. That's if you consider Ace to be successful, of course.

    Anyway, I like episodes that make me think. This was a good all round episode with great comedy and a nice pseudo sci-fi concept to have a laugh with. As others have said, I think a few of these episodes made under Dave, suffer a bit in their sense of abruption, or rounding of the end of the plot too quickly. I saw it suggested elsewhere, that these latter Dwarf episodes might benefit from a bit more time. (Say 45 minutes in a 50-60 minutes slot rather than the current half hour.) I think I agree. Past Red Dwarf largely managed to fill the time-slot however. One exception to my mind would be Gunmen of the Apocalypse. In that one's case, I felt it was the conclusion of the first part which was rounded off too quickly, with the quick and easy dispatch of the Simulant ship. It's still a favourite episode of mine,however.

    *That raises questions concerning the nature of holograms being essentially copies of the original counterpart, rather than actually their continued consciousness, but I won't think too deeply about that. A similar thing happened in Timeslides, after all.
     
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  19. Callisto252

    Callisto252 Supply Officer

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    The Star Knot thing is really bothering me - you may well be right there, as there's no obvious explanation for that title. Could it be following the same lines as Lister saying the Cat is so not a moron - is Rimmer so not a star?

    I was racking my brains to remember whether there was any cut dialogue where Kryten explains that he's going to fix the lesion in space/time using a 'star knot' - that's the only place I can think of where it might have been mentioned. Or perhaps Rimmer was going to make a star knot out of all those cables (there was quite a cable-y theme running through the episode!). I hope it's explained on the DVD.

    I agree, that was very satisfying. I don't recall that last scene being recorded on the night or being shown at the end of the last VT though - can anyone else remember who was there? (I know Seb was - and I've just realised I don't know how to tag people on here!).
     
  20. jmc2000

    jmc2000 Deck Sergeant

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    I think people are perhaps more literal about "Dennis the Doughnut Boy" than I would be. I took those lines from Series VIII to mean that Hollister joined the JMC in a very lowly position and achieved advancement through foul play. He's worried that this will come to light and also has hang-ups about his modest background. But I think he got from doughnut boy to captain by getting a series of promotions over the years, aided by inside knowledge. I don't think he's literally a doughnut boy pretending to be the captain. I think that's how he feels about himself (or believes others would see him) because he didn't achieve promotion fairly.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 5:21 PM

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