Holly?

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by voo7hees, May 12, 2010.

  1. voo7hees

    voo7hees Third Technician

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    why are people saying they want bill bailey for the next red dwarf season, norman might change his mind or hattie might want to do it, put the previous Holly's before replacements.
     
  2. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    I totally agree. I think Norman was my favourite Holly, (although I liked Hattie's too) although to be fair he was given more to do than Hattie. I think she should be given a chance to come back and given a chance.
    Either Hattie or have the no Holly scenario of Back To Earth.* I'd like him/her to return at some point though.



    *This left me wondering if that means they are just drifting aimlessly in space now. (Yeah, what's new right? Snigger.) However, looking at the consoles in their new bunk room, I like the idea that it's a kind of manual auxiliary point. A place to control the ship when the main program is off-line, so to speak.
     
  3. nicky_j

    nicky_j Deck Sergeant

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    I'm not sure where that idea came from. I wouldn't want any of the actors replacing, Holly included. I would rather they had no Holly at all. And I love bill bailey.
     
  4. Weevil

    Weevil Deck Sergeant

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    If they bring Holly back, Hattie would be perfect. She would most probably agree to do it so
    problem solved.
     
  5. Rageofangels

    Rageofangels First Technician

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    I'd want Norm to be Holly first of all.
    If not then Hattie or Bill would be great. I think Bill benefits from the fact that he can do the deadpan look very well - and the confused look too. Those are the looks that Holly needs.

    RAGE
     
  6. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    It all just came about because it seems unlikely Norm would return (and many wouldn't want him), and Hattie was removed because Holly's role in the story was taken by Kryten. I think a different kind of Holly, who could clash with Kryten and have a proper place among the crew as a character, would work well. There's still a place for a ship's computer. I don't remember who suggested Bill Bailey, but I thought he could take on the role as a slightly more manic Holly quite well.
     
  7. currymonster

    currymonster First Technician

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    Although having Bill Baily would seem like having a famous face for the sake of it, he might bring a new audience with him, people that have never watched the show, but love Bill and help encourage further series to be made with great audience figures
     
  8. CaptnDan

    CaptnDan Third Technician

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    The re-casting of Holly was something that came up in a drunken conversation the other day.

    Naturally, we agreed we'd want either Norman or Hattie to do it. But, if, for whatever reason, neither were available, we began trawling our minds for alternatives.

    For a male Holly, we went with: Paul Merton.

    But my personal favourite, was for another female Holly played by Isy Suttie (Dobby from Peep Show).

    I think she'd be amazing. She's got the same intelligent but a bit dipsy character that made Hattie's Holly so good.

    In fact, the more I think about it, the more I feel it'd be a good idea... Hmmm.. :-D
     
  9. KennyW

    KennyW Skutter

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    The character of Holly was back on form in series 8, partly cos it was norm maybe, partly cos d jokes were very funny. I liked the direction series 7 and 8 took, but judging by back to earth the new stuff is moving in a different direction. I think Norm shud've been in back to earth, but its too late for that talk haha. I just hope there is a Holly really! I'd rather anyone than no holly
     
  10. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    Really? I thought Holly was very different in Series 8. While his senility does manifest in the early series it mainly appears as eccentricity. You get the impression he'd still pull through when the need arose as shown by his manipulations of the crew in Queeg.

    With Hattie, Holly became more dippy. By series 8 he was mostly just daft. It makes sense from a character digression-through-senility point of view but I didn't find Holly nearly as funny as in the previous episodes. He had his moments even there, but I thought the series 8 Holly was the worst version.

    We've all got different tastes, though eh?

    For the record, I don't dislike series 7 and 8 overall. I thought 7 was pretty cracking actually.
     
  11. currymonster

    currymonster First Technician

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    if Holly had been in Back To Earth it all would have been over fairly quickly. I recon sooner rather than later Holly would have realised what was going on remembering what happened on the ocean moon with the dispair squid and brought the crew back around again using the gas he/she used then.

    Unless of course the joy squid can affect machines. Which has just brought me to realise that despite Rimmer being a hollogram, he was still affected by both squids ... hmmmm
     
  12. SoundableObject

    SoundableObject Catering Officer

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    In the show Holly would have been fixed by Katerina and then Holly would have made the dimension cutter. That means that when the gang woke up, Holly wouldn't have been around.
     
  13. Garry2rs

    Garry2rs Third Technician

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    Love Isy Suttie! She's a great stand up too!

    My guess is as the new stuff is most likely based around the Back To Earth period that there will be a FEMALE Holly.
    For the simple reason that as Kochanski had died, a new female charecter will be brought in.
    Who will play her (if it's Holly) is anyones guess.
     
  14. betelgeuse

    betelgeuse Catering Officer

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    I've changed my mind a couple of times on this;
    But since re-viewingthe 7th and 8th series...I loved Norman's return to the roles...
    so I would love to see Norman comeback to the role again, and he looks good as a grey holly - as exampled on that DVD Easter Egg music video 'Clear' by the band Intro2.
     
  15. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    The best thing about Norman in series 8 was that he was the only person who was completely honest about the quality of the show in the DVD commentaries.

    I felt sorry for him because its obvious he isn't taken seriously due to his reputation for moaning, wheras actually he's offering inciteful constructive criticism. He acts almost as a voice of the viewer who is slightly startled by the rest of the cast talking about how great every episode is. It's odd because in the early series, which were, imo, far better scripted the cast find fault with things a lot more. Maybe this is because they don't have Robert Llewlyn doing commentary at that point though as he seems to love everything.
     
  16. Andrew

    Andrew Executive Officer

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    Why do people think that agreeing with their own opinion on a series is the same as being honest?

    Remember when VIII came out? Record ratings, terrific critical response (the reviews were really strong. Sorry, but that's the way it was). It's seriously not possible that the cast were happy with the series and saying so is them being honest?!
     
  17. betelgeuse

    betelgeuse Catering Officer

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    lol I noticed that, I think Norman doesn't seem to mind being mr unpopular for being honest in hindsight, and really he should keep 'shtum' as he has the funniest lines in the whole series...But I think Robert Llewellyn REALLY does like those last two series alot...at least he's said that series VII is one of his favorite series, and actually you can't blame him, as the character of Kryten is explored alot more in series VII (and VIII) and the different facets and neuoticisms of the character.

    Like you say, 'hindsight is everything' OR 'hindsight is 20/20' - or whatever that saying is lol... and as always there's different aspects to take into account e.g. the budget the series had, the circumstances of the writing, the audience figures and reviews when the show first aired etc
    But I can't believe that there was a 'terrific critical response' for series VIII, though I'm sure you're right of course.
     
  18. Andrew

    Andrew Executive Officer

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    At the time it got huge positives - in quite notable contrast to the slating the earlier series got! Hell with it, I don't have all the reviews to hand - though I have got an old clippings file somewhere - but here's a quick grab of quotes from the VIII Scriptbook cover:

    [​IMG]

    Now sure, you may not care for that series. But these are matters of taste and Series VIII clearly achieved a lot of what it set out to do. You may not care for the goal, but that's a separate issue from intrinsic success.

    The failure to appreciate the success of Series VIII is, like so many things, often the misunderstanding that internet response does not directly mirror that of the real world. Were that the case, Firefly would be the most successful show in TV history.
     
  19. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    While its certainly impressive (if not mindboggling) to read some of the plaudits the show recieved, it has to be said that using a compendium of quotes culled by GNP to promote their own show on the inner sleave of an Official Red Dwarf product as a way of illustrating how universally well recieved series 8 was is about as useful as looking at a movie poster for Avatar and pretending it illustrates quality because of all the hyperbole cribbed from the Sun et al that it utilises to promote itself. The negative reviews simply arn't going to show up on either.

    Nobody is denying that some people liked series 8 but even those who loved it surely can't be blind to the well documented areas where it deservedly recieved criticism, yet it seems Norman is the only cast member honest enough to comment. If the other cast members really do think that Pete Part 2 is a flawless gem then...sorry but words fail me on that one.

    On another note I don't understand why anyone should feel that the opinions of magazine reviewers are anymore part of the "real world" than those expressed by independent people on the internet. Firefly didn't die because people in the "real world" had contrasting opinions about it to those on the internet (on the contrary it also recieved very good reviews), more likely it died because people in the real world didn't have a clue it existed due to the usual Fox issues (episodes aired out of order, lack of promotion, being bumped about in the time slot etc). Red Dwarf 8, in contrast recieved excellent promotion by the BBC and drew strong opening ratings as a result.

    I'd also note that not all of those reviews are reviews of the full series. I myself enjoyed the first episode immensely. I'd like to know what those reviewers thought about Pete Part 2 for instance.
     
  20. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Some people prefer to focus on the positive aspects of things, and the areas where they felt it did well, as opposed to focusing on the negatives. The cast just seem to prefer talking of those positive things, and reliving the times they enjoyed and felt went well. Doesn't mean they think it was perfect and doesn't deserve the criticisms it receives, or as you put it, they don't "notice these things". They just don't like to brood on the negatives when there are positives to be enjoyed.
     

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