Logic

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by archie918, Sep 2, 2009.

  1. archie918

    archie918 Second Technician

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    A lot of episodes have very flawed in logic. For example

    Timeslides-Doesnt lister remember rimmer from when he was 17

    Future Echoes-Why doesn't Lister+Cat go into stasis.

    Rimmerworld and Out of time- They have got a time machine in Rimmerworld so why do they not use it and why are they so excited when they get another one in out of time.

    Tikka to Ride-how does the time machine become a teleporter as well

    Why did Lister suddenly abandon the idea of bringing kochanski back after balance of power

    Demons and Angels-why didn't kryten use his nanobots to fix the ship

    Any other flaws or solution please post here.
     
  2. sanja

    sanja Supply Officer

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    Lister could bring him self as as a baby to The right time on Earth... But they couldn't go back home in their time??!! ;-)
     
  3. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    I gathered (very loosely) from Lister's speech to his son (himself) that Lister has come to the conclusion that he can never use time travel to return home as his destiny is to ensure that the human race does not become extinct in his own time (3 million years in the future)
     
  4. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    He probably just forgot. That's a good point though, you'd think he would remember the man with the 'totally shady' H accompanying the man who gave him the key to his fortune. I never really thought of that... Then again that whole set up is paradoxical if you think it through. By changing the timeline he wouldn't have been able to go back to change his past in the first place. Maybe this is another example of a whole new timeline being generated with elements of the others to deal with the paradox. Or, he just forgot, as I said. (His mind might have rotted with all the high life anyway.)

    They came without warning. By then they were already experiencing them. Of course they could have gone into stasis when the first occurred but I think we're to assume events followed rather quickly after that. Even if it it didn't I wouldn't say it didn't make sense not to go into stasis though. To go or not to go... both are still viable options. Especially as they needed to stay slinky in case, say, parts were to break down and explode due to the stress of hyper-light travel...

    That one's easy. It's a teleporter. It's status as a time machine is accidental, so I doubt it's something that they could set accurately.

    Two options. One, the new universe that was generated to deal with the paradox combined both versions of the time-drive (i.e. the one owned by the Dwarfers which could travel anywhere in time but not space, and the broken future version which could travel anywhere in space but only into the future.) Two, maybe it could always travel through time and space. Kryten just missed the spatial settings.

    Um... Actually he didn't cos he tried it again in Stasis Leak. After that, I think he just became more accepting of his current situation especially as he knew he was fated to meet her again due to the events of that episode (albeit it didn't happen the way he thought).

    Ummm... he couldn't be sure that would work.

    Apart from the creative reasons, i.e a) Rob and Doug hadn't thought up Kryten's nanobots then, and b) it would be a bit rubbish to use them for every 'fixing' solution I'd say Kryten might not be sure that they would work. The 'reverse the field' triplicator ploy seemed the most likely of unlikely resolutions at the time.

    Besides, I have the theory that the nanonbots actually grew in ability. I imagine they were originally only able to perform repairs on Kryten, and possibly only simple ones at that. However, Kryten has been online far beyond the 4000 series usual lifespan and broken his programming. I imagine the nanobots did too. Apart from becoming self aware and uppity, it's possible they even physically evolved too. As repair 'bots' it's quite possible they fixed and upgraded each other too, possibly even made 'children' from various spare molecules lying around. They were far beyond what they had been, and probably even Kryten didn't know the extent of their power until he caught up with them in series 7. He knew that with reprogramming they'd give Lister a new arm, but turning space ships into planetoids? Bear in mind it was quite late in the day that they realised the nanobots were responsible for swiping Red Dwarf.
     
  5. pole85

    pole85 First Technician

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    i always wondered why in stasis leak the didn't just go back and fix the ship so the drive plate wouldn't blow up. i know at the end why they wouldn't but it should have been the plan from the beginning
     
  6. bedfordfalls

    bedfordfalls Deck Sergeant

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    Not a flaw since that timeline was erased by Lister making himself the inventor of the tension sheet

    Not a flaw. Lister is given renewed impetus by visions of the future showing him onboard Red Dwarf and having 2 babies so decides to stay.
    Firstly its highly dangerous and capable of turning people inside out and as pointed out elsewhere they don't know how to use it properly. Perhaps Kryten is still studying it.

    This one I agree is very badly explained, if you can count some star-trek waffle about dimensional anomalies as an explanation, but then what does make sense about this episode? It's played for laughs and logic is discarded for them.

    I don't think he did its just that the show explored other themes until Stasis Leak where he had every right to expect that all he had to do was hang around for five years.

    Kryten didn't have anything to do with the nanobots actions, they acted independently and only obeyed him when he had them trapped adn threatened.
     
  7. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    It can be fun to find our own logical reasons for things that dont quite add up or the lack of continuity, but i never got why Lister is trying to teach Kryten to lie in series 4 ?, when he was already capable of doing so in series 3, albeit as a joke.

    KRYTEN: the only truely sad thing , is that as my registerd owner, you have to die with me.
    LISTER: what ! ?
    KRYTEN: joke, deadpan mode.
     
  8. pole85

    pole85 First Technician

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    I think the biggest question is why did holy take red dwarf 3 million years into deep-space? Surely Holy could have taken RD near earth where they would be able to either decontaminate the ship or have some way of getting Lister out of the ship ie; radiation suits or something, but then of course there would be no show.:shock:
     
  9. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    Seeing as Red Dwarf was travelling at the speed of light in 'Future Echoes' perhaps during the hours that they were experienceing future echoes Holly managed to turn round and shave off a couple of millenia in their journey back to Earth. This might mean that it became possible that Lister would arrive home at some point within his lifetime and that going into stasis was a redundant idea. This could also explain why there was a lot of Human ships three million years into deep space - they were much nearer to Earth then they were at the start of 'Future Echoes.
     
  10. matty9896

    matty9896 Third Technician

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    Maybe holly has no control over the steering of the ship, only running the engines and keeping everything else in check. notice how red dwarf never appears to be turning or manouvering.
     
  11. matty9896

    matty9896 Third Technician

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    one thing taht has always bugged me though - how and why does rimmer explode at the end of timeslides??
     
  12. garfie

    garfie Catering Officer

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    The boxes labled 'explosives' that he hits probably had something to do with it.
     
  13. pole85

    pole85 First Technician

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    I just noticed and made me wonder where did Rimmer get the dna to clone himself in rimmer world? Also When Lister wiped out the Inqiusitor how did he know he himself wouldn't be eliminated because he very well could have been the non-original Lister?
     
  14. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    I wondered about that too! My theory is that maybe the DNA information was stored on his light bee (or the ship's computer, I'm not clear if the light be is all self contained or just a projector) and that is used to produce the hologram. Seems like overkill to produce a simulation, but, anyhoo. Either way I think the information was stored digitally. Presumably the advanced equipment on the shuttle could replicate the DNA sequence in chemical form. I'm not sure how, but I think DNA, for all it's complexity is made up of basic elements which could theoretically be recombined...

    I think I see what you mean. I suppose it's possible that a duplicate could also turn out to 'not being worthy of having existed' but I think it's clear in Lister's case he is the original, although we can't prove that for sure with all the removing from existence shenanigans. I'm not sure the Inquisitor would take it that far too judge the replacements as well. Or if he would, I think he'd wait until he had judged all originals first.
     
  15. Paul Taylor

    Paul Taylor Console Officer

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    But he probably had wiped out all the originals first. And then started judging those that came after. The Inquisitor's tom-foolery means that he must have had a huge influence on history, and his elimination from history would change all of human existance. So it's best not to think about it too much.:lol:
     
  16. acerimmer_165

    acerimmer_165 Supply Officer

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    Just found this...

    CLICK HERE

    That's a lot of plot holes!!!

    And it offers explainations for ALL of your problems (or at least most of them!)
     
  17. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    Rewatching 'Krytie TV' I've got a few questions:

    1. Kryten claims that they shower three times a week. This seems a little unrealistic as in most prisons inmates shower at least once a day in the interest of hygiene and the spread of germs and diseases.

    2. Plus, despite being convicts, they are allowed to spend over three hours in the shower. Who needs a three hour long shower??
     
  18. Paul Taylor

    Paul Taylor Console Officer

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    In that shower, I could easily kill three hours!
     
  19. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    The Tank is meant to be a pretty rank place.

    They're women. It's a joke.
     
  20. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    We've pondered the 'three hour shower' question on this board in the past. My opinion is that it was just a mistake on Doug's part.

    Another question arises from the scene in which Kryten is being chased by Rimmer and Lister after they've trashed Ackerman's quarters. On the screen that the convicts are watching, the camera angle swaps from Kryten's point of view to a shot of him filmed from in front. Who is filming Kryten from in front?
     

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