Random Thoughts About... Series III

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by jedshepherd, Nov 3, 2015.

  1. Seb

    Seb Captain Staff Member

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    I thiiiink if you go to the first post, and hit "Edit Post", you can change the title there. Let me know if it doesn't work, though!
     
  2. jedshepherd

    jedshepherd Console Officer

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    It wont let me edit the title. Could you swap out Polymorph for Season 3 perhaps?
     
  3. Seb

    Seb Captain Staff Member

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    So you can't! That's weird, I thought you guys had that option. I'll do it at admin level, then!
     
  4. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    This was the fifth RD episode I ever saw as a kid (Queeg being my first) and it was by this point I realised I'd gone from thinking Red Dwarf a pretty good show to being a massive fan. I still think this a classic episode, and definitely my favourite 'monster of the week' episode. It has a bit of everything: action, great dialogue, brilliant gags and my favourite 'alternate Dwarfers', especially Rimmer and Lister once effected by the Polymorph. Cat's alternative as was funny too, and for me this is the first episode where Robert Llewellyn really shines as Kryten.
     
  5. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Deck Sergeant

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    I'm catching up with the podcasts now, I'm about half way through Thanks for the Memory, having started with The End on Monday.

    A couple of things that I'd like to pick up on. You've mentioned a number of times with regard to Rimmer and Yvonne McGruder that he slept with her whilst she was unconscious, but I'm pretty certain that wasn't supposed to be the case. Lister does say regarding McGruder "She'd been hit on the head by a winch, she had concussion!" but he never said that she was unconscious, in fact further into the dialogue there are other comments "She kept calling you Norman" and "She had wonky vision and thought you were someone else" that make it fairly clear that she was awake. True, this still doesn't paint Rimmer in a particularly great light as he's clearly taking advantage of McGruder whilst she's in a confused and vulnerable state *, but at least it's a lot less rapey than him finding her out cold and just thinking "Well, she can't say no, so...".

    You're also at this point referencing the novels a bit. The only problem with cross-referencing the novels with the TV series is that there are a number of discrepencies and contradictions between them, I believe the novels are widely regarded as a separate continuity since that's the only real way to reconcile all the differences between the two (As apparently the aborted movie was to be a separate continuity too). This is why personally I'm a little wary of using too much material from the novels to support points about things that occur in the series, just because it happens in the novels doesn't mean it happened in the series and vice-versa.

    Lastly (For now ;-) ), you mentioned at one point that you could see when they were running out of material from the novels but I think it's worth pointing out that in almost every case the TV series were written first with the novels coming later.

    Anyway, just wanted to add at this stage that I'm enjoying the podcasts very much, even if I do download them to my computer! ;-)

    * Oh, and just to contradict myself here slightly, IIRC Last Human also contradicts Rimmer's recollection of events, but if you haven't read/listened to that or haven't done so recently enough to recall, I wont spoil it.
     
  6. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    The episode white hole is the only episode that took from the novel instead of the other way round because series 4 came after the BTL novel was released

    But rob and doug did tend to use the first novel as a basis for the backstory since kochanski dumping lister was in the novel but didn't happen in the show and series 7 in the flashback seemed to be more like the novel instead of series 1

    but then doug changed that for Series 8 onwards
     
  7. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Deck Sergeant

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    And the reference in DNA to Kochanski dumping Lister, contradicting Series I and II was a deliberate attempt to bring the TV show more in line with the novels. Personally, I prefered the idea of Kochanski as Lister's One That Got Away missed opportunity rather than him being her rebound fling.
     
  8. jedshepherd

    jedshepherd Console Officer

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    Drawing a line under POLYMORPH as we have recorded that episode now...
    ===========================================================================

    So can we have your Random thoughts on the next episode... BODYSWAP!

    What are you favourite things about Bodyswap and also the things you dislike about it. It certainly isn't a classic in my eyes...

    Thoughts?
     
  9. Strat-tastic

    Strat-tastic Flight Co-Ordinator

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    One of my favourite opening scenes in Red Dwarf, with a hilarious pay off.
     
  10. Diet_coke

    Diet_coke Science Officer

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    Agreement
     
  11. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Deck Sergeant

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    Not the best IMO, but I did enjoy it. I've never really understood the bit where Lister/Rimmer faceplants into the mashed potato and pours gravy over the back of his head, however much I've enjoyed a meal or been looking forward to it I've never been tempted to pour sauce over myself.

    The dubbing, whilst it was pretty hi-tech for the time always somehow seemed slightly off to me too.

    But then it did have some really good moments, the stand outs for me would have to be Rimmer's "fat b**tard" speech and the "I've lost your watch too" exchange as well as the opening, but the genuinely LOL moments are just fewer and further apart for me than in most of the rest of Series III.
     
  12. Diet_coke

    Diet_coke Science Officer

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    One of my favourite moments is when cat drops the cassette of listers brain into his cup of tea.
     
  13. jedshepherd

    jedshepherd Console Officer

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    actually this for me, is the best moment in the episode.
     
  14. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Bodyswap at times for me felt the most series 1 and 2ish of in series 3. Some of the bunk dialog before the swap itself felt very reminiscent of the show's earliest days. I like bodyswap but it is held back but how unconvincingly it handles it's core idea...I mean the dubbing is kinda dodgy to the point where I found it distracting at times......still I liked it.
     
  15. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Deck Sergeant

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    I think you've got the wrong episode. I'm pretty certain that's Demons and Angels.
     
  16. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    I don't know why anyone would think the Emohawk was the second polymorph as it's clear from the start that the Emohawk was set on them by the Kinitawowi. That being said, Emohawk does feel like two episodes so maybe the first part on the Gelf moon gets forgotten.

    I'm not sure it's a separate breed, (although it's critter form is very different, but as they're shapeshifters I think their default form could be their own choice.) It was described as a polymorph that had been spayed and partially domesticated, I believe.

    I've often wondered why Rimmer and Cats' physical appearance (hair and teeth, not clothes. The characters did that themselves.) would change. I have a theory, but I won't share that here, as this is not the thread, and it has already moved on....


    ... so on to Bodyswap. (Sorry Jed. I came to this late hence backtracking a bit above. I was just so surprised people were even speculating over that!)

    This is not my favourite episode. Some bits grossed me out a bit. Mainly involving Rimmer in Lister's body gorging. Not so much the fact he was doing it- that was amusing- I'm just finicky about seeing food around people mouths, etc. Silly, I know. But it contains one of my favourite sequences in Red Dwarf ever. The rewired Red Dwarf and triggering the self-destruct and the solution and pay-off (and the Cat dropping chip in coffee gag) was just brilliant and very funny.

    And it was a pretty good episode overall. Seeing the guys playing each other's characters was amusing and the story was great.

    I think this is one episode where I preferred footage from the remastered version namely the craft chase scene at the end. The first was a variance on the old snow planet crash thing, done very well to be fair. The other involved some asteroid wooshy stuff, which I found more thrilling. That being said the CG animation didn't quite work.

    And that last joke at the end.

    "That's not funny!"
    "No, but this is!"

    Thinking about it, it's interesting that the lads seemed to swap roles along with their bodies. Rimmer becoming a layabout hedonist, and Lister becoming a bit prim and judgemental, albeit understandably so! And the writing is so good, it's believable!

    Did I say this was not a favourite episode of mine? I'm starting to question myself! A great episode!
     
  17. talkie3000

    talkie3000 Deck Sergeant

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    Whats weird is that they remastered it to make it better but it had limitations of its own that still make the Original look like perhaps it was better off since in the remastered starbug crashes into a part of the cave wall head on at full speed and all you see is a shot of smoke so we know it crashed and then the next shot its laying on the cave floor... i guess the crash would have been too expensive or just look to fake to pull off
     
  18. jedshepherd

    jedshepherd Console Officer

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    any more thoughts on BODYSWAP? we have a whole week to come up with them!

    You will like the stuff we did with your comments on Polymorph... really went into board politics. Also Billy from the band The Subways really had it in for one of you... (in a very constructive way!)
     
  19. djmcbell

    djmcbell Supply Officer

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    It seems my comment (as well as a few others) disappeared, so I'll try to summarise it again.

    Bodyswap, like Polymorph, is another episode which every sci-fi has to have - people swapping bodies. The main difference though is that it's not an accident but instead an arrangement for Rimmer to improve Lister. There's not a huge amount of stand-out humour in this episode (though I do love the start, when Lister accidentally sets off the self-destruct, then attempts to stop it and instead makes it go faster), but the chase scene is fantastic, something butchered in the Remastered edition (which is odd too, as it was used as a highlight in one of the trailers).

    The best bits though are that Rimmer, now with a body, finally has an outlet for all his pent-up frustration - he's able to gorge himself in every possible way, and it was fun to see him in the chase sequence clutching a bun.
     
  20. jedshepherd

    jedshepherd Console Officer

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    for those that posted Bodyswap comments, some of them disappeared, so if you can post them again, that would be cool!
     

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