Rimmer the rapist?

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by adelesilva, Jan 7, 2012.

  1. adelesilva

    adelesilva Skutter

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    Someone told me that Rimmer once raped a woman when she was concussed and unable to give consent. Is this true?
     
  2. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    This is the dialogue in question from Confidence and Paranoia in series 1. Make of it what you will:

    RIMMER: What about Yvonne MacGruder? That was a date.
    LISTER: She'd been hit on the head by a winch, she had a concussion.
    RIMMER: That's got nothing to do with it. She was crazy about me.
    LISTER: Oh, yeah? She kept calling you "Norman."
    RIMMER: She still went to bed with me.
    LISTER: Yeah, because she had wonky vision and she thought you were somebody else.
    RIMMER: Serves her right for being concussed, doesn't it?


    I always wonder if the fact that she called him Norman was an in-joke.
     
  3. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    He had an affair with a lady (Yvonne McGruder) but it was with her consent. It was mentioned in the books that she suffered concussion at the time, so I guess it's arguable whether or not she was in her right frame of mind.

    Spoiler:

    This led to certain twist in Last Human, where the concussion affected her by making her wonder if the affair had been real rather than losing her ability to reason at the time.

    I forget if the same was true in the series. (Edit, okay, according to previous post that came while I was writing this, yes, it's mentioned there too.) I'd find it comparable to people getting it on after getting drunk. They might not if they were in their right frame of mind... but does that make them unaccountable? Rimmer didn't 'help himself' to an comatose woman, I get the impression she was very willing.
     
  4. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Further to this an additional spin is thrown into the mix in the novels, where it turns out McGruder did know who he was, but as a result of her concussion was unsure if it had actually happened or if she had just dreamt it. Obviously her being dead at the time of the story being told in the show renders any chance to learn if this is the extended fact of the matter in that universe somewhat speculative.

    EDIT: which is basically the same as what M'Aiden has said above.
     
  5. Cruel Slayer

    Cruel Slayer Console Officer

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    I'm never comfortable with this when it comes up in the episode. It's treated quite flippantly, but there certainly are questions to be asked about the morality of Rimmer if he could take advantage of a woman in those circumstances. I could probably say that, in the eighties, this sort of comedy seemed quite natural, and the idea of taking advantage of a woman who was concussed, paralytic with alcohol, whatever, was decidedly dodgy but a perfectly reasonable thing to expect a neurotic, delusional nut-job like Rimmer to do.
     
  6. ori-STUDFARM

    ori-STUDFARM Supply Officer

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    Although, he can also be the victim too....Look at what happened with Uncle Frank!
     
  7. supercat

    supercat Console Officer

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    How about maybe Lister was exaggerating a little, suggesting that women would only sleep with Rimmer if there were concuss. Also, how about it's fiction and no one actually had sex or was taken advantage of?

    No one suggested she was unconscious... gowd! She was awake and consenting, just a little out of it... as one would be with too much to drink.

    Look at me... even I've been dragged in after all... IT'S NOT REAL!
     
  8. adelesilva

    adelesilva Skutter

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    but "having sex" with a woman who's too concussed to be sensible or too drunk to give meaningfull consent is legally rape, at least in the real world. I find it hard to believe that Rimmer would have escaped consequences, especially from the Space Corps, if not McGruder herself.
     
  9. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Nobody ever says she was too insensible to give meaningful consent at the end of the day. It's little more than an excuse to make fun at Rimmer's sex life, or lack there-of for the most part, by stating only someome concussed would ever consider having sex with him. There is no indication ever actually given that it was non-consentual.
     
  10. supercat

    supercat Console Officer

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    Yeah. That's that I was trying to say!! Lister was just making fun of him... C'mon everyone, get a grip!
     
  11. carparkattendant

    carparkattendant Third Technician

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    'Tecnically she would be my sister and therefore unable to take me as her lover... what the hell, I just wouldn't tell her!'

    Old Iron Balls isn't the most honourable man when it comes to getting it on I suppose.
     
  12. Number_58

    Number_58 Second Technician

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    Well the worst elements of Rimmer do make up "I'm going to lash you to within an inch of your life. And then I'm going to have you."
     
  13. thecogre

    thecogre First Technician

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    i always viewed these instances with a grain of salt, so to speak. they are ways to show what a wretched specimen is rimmer. almost like a morality tale, don't be a rimmer.
     
  14. carparkattendant

    carparkattendant Third Technician

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    We're laughing and learning!
     
  15. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    It seems more of a case that she took advantage of Rimmer. He seems to be in denial or ignorance of the fact that she only slept with him because she thought he was this Norman character. The implication I got is that Rimmer had a bit of a crush on her and, judging by her appearence in 'Better than Life', she came on rather strongly and made a move on him, to which he felt that all his dreams had come true.

    Also, you can't really do much in twelve minutes if you have to squeeze in eating a pizza.
     
  16. ori-STUDFARM

    ori-STUDFARM Supply Officer

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    ...and to be fair, you would wouldn't you! Honestly....this is a joke. Admittedly, a slightly poor taste one. But I thought it was funny. Just poorly tasted...Hence I feel the need to add this incase I get quoted...Live long and prosper
     
  17. carparkattendant

    carparkattendant Third Technician

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    Bet you got a peep hole bra under that eh! (bites fist)
     
  18. ori-STUDFARM

    ori-STUDFARM Supply Officer

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    Wha!! How can you tell!!?........

    .oh, yeah. Right! It was a quote.....I knew that! :lol:
     
  19. codename_47

    codename_47 First Technician

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    I find this very suspicious this has come up now, you know....

    I really hope this isn't referenced in any way in series Ten.....
     
  20. supercat

    supercat Console Officer

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    Can't be a reference to the controversy of Saturday's recording. It was posted before the shoot.
     

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