So what happened between series 8 and BTE?

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by frizzler, Apr 14, 2009.

  1. frizzler

    frizzler Skutter

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    Heres the way I see it, and I'd like to hear what you think.
    As others have said this Rimmer is clearly the old rimmber because he has immunities to the despair squid like the other crew. If it wasn't for that then it would be simple to assume that it was the new rimmer as a hologram because in both the real ending and the preferd alternate ending it could be argued that he died (in the alternate ending the can hits him in the back of the head). If he did die in the alternate ending, surely he would have been brought back as a hologram, so if the old rimmer did come back as Ace they would have to choose between the two because as we know the ship can't host two holograms, in the real ending rimmer dies in in the normal dimension and the rest of them escape to the new dimension. So, here are my possible ideas:
    - Real ending: Rimmer dies in the old dimension and the others never return from the new dimension because by the time they reopen the portal the ship is completely gone. Eventually they find ace rimmer (because as we know he travels into different dimensions) and he decides, or has decided already, to stop being ace rimmer.
    - Alt ending: Rimmer survives the can to the head, that just hurts him. Some time later, the old rimmer (Ace) returns and quits being ace. Now that old rimmer is here, theres no way any of them can be brought back as hologram's. New rimmer dies some time after.


    Pick holes, gives other suggestions, and generally discuss :-D
     
  2. Tex_Rimmer

    Tex_Rimmer First Technician

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    I think he's not the old Rimmer, he's simply a copy of the Old Rimmer. "The Old Rimmer" is still out there being Ace. Just because a hologram leaves doesn't mean they can't pull another light bee out of storage, load up his memory and make another one. Blue, despite the ending, shows that Lister really does enjoy Rimmer's company on some bizarre level, and maybe making a new Rimmer hologram was seen as some kind of tribute after the live Rimmer died again at the end of Only the Good.


    As others have said this Rimmer is clearly the old rimmber because he has immunities to the despair squid like the other crew.

    All that means is that that immunity was added to the backup copy of Rimmer's hologram disc at some point.


    if the old rimmer did come back as Ace they would have to choose between the two because as we know the ship can't host two holograms,

    Except when they can. Besides, Ace, wherever he is now, is not being "hosted" by Red Dwarf.


    in the real ending rimmer dies in in the normal dimension and the rest of them escape to the new dimension.

    BTE does not take place in the reverse dimension, so somehow they must have come back, which means that somehow they saved Red Dwarf. It would be nice if they explained it a bit, but it's clear what happened.


    - Real ending: Rimmer dies in the old dimension and the others never return from the new dimension because by the time they reopen the portal the ship is completely gone. Eventually they find ace rimmer (because as we know he travels into different dimensions) and he decides, or has decided already, to stop being ace rimmer.

    There's no need whatever for Rimmer from BTE to be the same hologram as Ace.
     
  3. Dwarfer_Stu

    Dwarfer_Stu Second Technician

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    Here's what i reckon;

    the crew in the mirror universe get the úber smart people in that universe to work out what the opposite to the 'cure' would be, so they have the virus, then use the mirror universe's dimension portal thingy to come back, and then the virus would turn into the cure and save the ship, but not in time to save rimmer. the rest of the crew dont realise, keep flying away in the starbugs and blue midgets, and they ressurect rimmer as a hologram (which comes from an outdated disc which has his previous memory on), restoring the old rimmer we've known and loved, while a replica flies on out there somewhere being ace.
     
  4. GuffyGuy

    GuffyGuy Second Technician

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    I'd pay money to find out...
     
  5. robjungle

    robjungle Third Technician

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    This was the first of the many proplems I had with BTE. They just couldnt be bothered to link it to series 8! Even when Kryten magically reappeared in Series 3, at least they had the star-wars style writing at the beginning which linked series 2 to 3, and was kind of a gag in it´s own right. This time they just didn´t bother.
     
  6. wannabe

    wannabe First Technician

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    Maybe we should just use our imagination. :?
     
  7. kakchris

    kakchris Third Technician

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    i think that series 8 rimmer died and then a new hologram rimmer was loaded up that automaticly had all the memories the old hologram had while with the red dwarf crew .the only flaw with that is where did the hard light bee come from ?
     
  8. mikehaseloff

    mikehaseloff Third Technician

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    Too dangerous, maam. Who knows what unspeakable plausibilities might be exposed.

    Recommend instead we speculate wildly, assume the worst, and pack for rain.
     
  9. sctt_pike

    sctt_pike Skutter

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    Ok this is to any creator/actor or anyone in the company of red dwarf who knows: What happened between season 8 and 9?

    When we left, the ending I watched red dwarf had been rebuilt, including all the people and old smeg head Rimmer, except for Kuchanski and Lister since they were already alive, even though Christine Kuchanski wasn't the original Christine but another Christine from a parallel universe. Some bug or something was eating the ship and kryten, cat, Lister and christine had all run away leaving Old flesh Rimmer to get boinked on the head and almost get collected by the Grim Reaper of Death before Rimmer kicks him in the nuts and runs away. The ship look like it was going to be destroyed and Rimmer probably died anyway unless he found a way of this ship. On this show, thats not impossible

    So here are the unanswered questions
    :?:
    1. How did they get back to the Red Dwarf? or assuming they are in the mirror universe Red Dwarf from the last episode what happened to all the people there in that universe?

    2. What happend to flesh old Rimmer? Did he die? Did he escape ? Did take over as the Grim Reaper after kicking him in the nuts and escape death that way and perhaps we will see him in the future when Lister is about to die? That would be funny?
    3. WHo is the new hologram Rimmer? Backup of the old Rimmer before he left to be Ace maybe?
    4. How is Rimmer and the other chick a solid-light hologram? They got that technology from legion and as a far as theybe said they never made another one.
    5. How can there be 2 holograms I thought the red dwarf could only support one?
    6. Where the smeg was holly? I heard the explanation for it but it bites that we didn't have some version of holly the idiot computer.

    OK creators and writers of Red Dwarf please answer thease question on the website even if you can never film them, do a freaking audio book like "Infinity Welcomes Careful drivers" and its 2 sequals. Just have Dave and Rimmer read it. But if you don't write it be prepared to be stalked in all your emails for the rest of your life and beyond about the answers to these questions.
     
  10. MacabreMagpie

    MacabreMagpie Catering Officer

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    These are the answers most of us have come up with after watching the episodes, they seem to make sense to me..

    Presumably they got the antidote from the mirror universe and came back through.

    One theory is that he died and they brought him back as hologram again. But with Kryten saying in Part 3 of BtE that their "previous encounter" with the despair squid strengthened their immune systems against its ink would suggest that this is the original Rimmer since he was the one who was in Back To Reality. So if that's the case, maybe the "new" Rimmer died on the burning Red Dwarf, and the original Rimmer returned from being Ace somewhere in series 9 or 10.

    See above.

    Further evidence that it's the old Rimmer. As for Katerina, she wasn't real.

    She wasn't real.

    Apart from the onscreen explanation, it was for budget reasons, plus they'd have little use for him when they got to Earth. Plus Norman has said he'll never play Holly again and has been slagging off the cast and crew.
     
  11. frizzler

    frizzler Skutter

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    Is this true??? Have you got links to interviews where he's slagged them off? Not saying I don't believe you I'm just interested to see them.
     
  12. kakchris

    kakchris Third Technician

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    it was on his myspace . he was slagging of the cast and creators of red dwarf while plugging a autobiography thats going to be about him slagging of the cast and creators of red dwarf .. and he did also say he does not want to be involved in any future red dwarf projects .... what a shame :-D
     
  13. wannabe

    wannabe First Technician

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    Loving this topic. Maybe bring back Hattie.
     
  14. TheChronicler

    TheChronicler Skutter

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    I think if we are looking logically about it...

    The original red dwarf was stripped by krytens nanobots and turned into that planet, the new red dwarf by the end of series eight was being eaten alive by that outbreak...

    So we have two outcomes

    Outcome 1 - the crew manage to come back from the reverse mirror universe with the antidote and save that current Red Dwarf
    Or
    Outcome 2 - They except there fate and stay in the mirror universe however Rimmer dies

    Outcome 1, would not explain how the re-incarnated Rimmer became the Rimmer who remembers the dispare squid, That Red Dwarf has never been going for 3000 years so has no record of what the previous rimmer holograme got upto. The newly built red dwarf was remade before the budget cut backs, that didnt have hard light.

    Outcome 2, would explain how the crew possible be re-united by Ace Rimmer who decides to ditch his career. But would not explain how they returned from the mirror universe, and how RED DWARF existed after the outbreak that was eating the ship that they were suposed to cure.

    Personally i think the following occured...

    Or my outcome 3,

    Ace Rimmer is spent the past few years dodging and hiding for his life as he is still a coward even as Ace Rimmer. His spaceship is capable of reality warp so its possible that he could appear in either our universe, there universe or the mirror universe. But in journey wise i would say that Ace Rimmer returns to the red dwarf dressed as the grim reaper, a disguse he doned for some unknown reason. Maybe a pratical joke he was going to play on Lister, only to find the ship is falling apart. Ace Rimmer finds Rimmer who knees him but later catches up and saves his life, finding out that he has been ressurected, and haunted by the time that Red Dwarf had two rimmers and they didnt get along. Ace Rimmer convinces The Living Rimmer to become Ace Rimmer, were as Ace Rimmer returns as the hardlight holograme rimmer, They travel to the mirror universe to meet up with the crew onboard the mirror red dwarf.

    The Crew (Lister, Kryten, Cat and Kochanski) cant stand the mirror universe personalities, after reuniting with the two Rimmers, The crew crammed into Ace Rimmers one man space craft travel back to there reality and force the krytens self repair nanos to build yet another red dwarf but get it right this time, However before they can they find that the original red dwarf appears. It appears that the Nano's have a sense of humour, they never brokedown the old ship and its been hiding behind a moon ever since series 8.

    Now back on board the Red Dwarf with the crew they continue there journey back to earth. Except for the living Rimmer who had become the new Ace Rimmer and goes on his own adventures. But gets killed two seconds later... upon there journey home, Lister runs a bath and floods the main deck which fries Holly and the ship is running on emergancy systems meaning its now traveling twice as slow that it was before, They try to fix the ship but end up back at the planet where they first encounter the dispare squid, only the cat meets the Joy Squid and although prepairs to eat it, saves it for later only to loose it in the water tanks. After nearly destroying red dwarf through drinking Kochanski escapes via blue midget faking to which Kyrten lies... several years pass and Back To Earth happens. If i was to make a prediction, Kochanski finds the remaining crew of the red dwarf who departed at the end of series 8 and is now dating Todd Hunter....
     
  15. steven87gill

    steven87gill Second Technician

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    I figured the virus got to the drive plates, causing a radiation leak... which then wiped out the virus. Krytens Nanobots bought time for rimmer to escape as a way of saying sorry for the trouble they caused, but sacrifice themselves in the process, that'd be quite a nice moving way to bring the nanobots story to an end.
     
  16. hypered001

    hypered001 Skutter

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    There are simple explanations for certain things that may seem to break continuity, let me exlain:- during series III Kryten learns to lie, but in Series IV he has do it all over again and suddenly Lister has dated Kochanski in the past, this is because when Lister saw his future self in 'Timeslides' he made himself a better future, altering current events, just as Rimmer did when he came to life temporarily. This in turn erased the five-years-hence future of 'Statis Leak'. Fast forward to the gap between series V and VI - 'Prelude to Nanarchy' covers this nicely but it's also likely that Cat's joy squid was left in the deep sleep pods at the beginning of 'Psirens' and the Red Dwarf/Nano size change incident in 'Back in the Red' accounts for it suddenly being huge - lying dormant in the water tanks during series VIII. With 'Only the good...' it's possible the deleted ending with the party (see the dvd) may have some relevance, ie: 1) Lister, Kryten, Kochanski and the Cat go through the mirror. 2) Rimmer returns, gets hit with the can (as shown) and imagines the grim reaper/ dies (again). 3) L,K,K and C return with the right formula in Kryten's memory (his mech memory would counter the mirror effect). 4) anti-virus used and fixes ship. 5) Rest of crew, having already evacuated, starve/ suffocate in their escape vessels. 6) Kryten brings Rimmer(2) back as hologram but updates him with hard light and Rimmer(1) memories (any modern memory stick/card can be copied and Kryten would likely have stored the hardlight data himself) and the rest as they say is history - Kochanski does a runner and Lister overloads Holly with an overflowing bathtub.

    I hope this provides a satisfying yet wholesome read for those who want to know.;-)
     
  17. Underpanski

    Underpanski Skutter

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    All these ideas are clever and insight full, but here's my theory.
    After Rimmer returned from the mirror universe and kicked death in the nuts he ran off but with Red Dwarf in flames the floor gave way and Rimmer fell five floors down to his death. Then he woke up to find himself inside the AR machine from Back In The Red, it turns out that Cassandra, Krytie TV and Pete weren't real. They were still in their trial from Back In The Red but after Rimmer died in the computer world then the five of them automatically woke up. After watching the havoc they caused in AR Captain Holister didn't want them on his ship so he forced them to take a Blue Midget into deep space. Then while they were traveling they decided to find the nanobots, in trying to track them down they bumped into Ace, he told them that he decided to quit and return to the possy. When he saw the new Rimmer generated by the nanobots he decided to make him the next ace so he took off all of his ace cloths and used the light bee remote to return back to normal and the new Rimmer left as the new Ace. With the old Rimmer back they found the nanobots buzzing around the remains of the Planetoid that they made from the original Red Dwarf. Actually the planetoid wasn't all Red Dwarf, a lot of it was other Space Core ships that had been abandoned, with the remains of the old Red Dwarf and the other Space Core ships made into a planetoid they had more than enough rescources to rebuild Red Dwarf. This time they told the nanobots to give the ship it's original shape back and not resurrect the dead crew making the Red Dwarf you see in Back To Earth!:roll:
     
  18. RedMidget

    RedMidget First Technician

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    One word Nanobots
    Before the Small Rouge one was destroyed Holly whipped up a batch of nanobots to rebuild the ship and deal with the virus and re-open the portal to the mirror universe and kryters, crissie, lister and cat come back just after Rimmer is killed by a hull breach before Holly whipped up the Nanobots, the virus flees to the minour ships of red dwaf and destroyes them, Holly brings rimmer back on the back-up light bee from Starbug 1's werakage, which contains the data form the dispair squid incident.
     
  19. jacksolomonsmith

    jacksolomonsmith First Technician

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    They go to the mirror universe, Rimmer is dead in the over universe, the crew then go through to another mirror universe, which of course them being IN a mirror universe means that it's actually a correct universe, the rouge one is no longer a pencil. Rimmer is a hologram, and as for the rest of the crew? Well perhaps the Mirror crew just suck them out of an airlock and take their places. Yeah that sounds likely.
     
  20. RedMidget

    RedMidget First Technician

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    Series 8 alternate ending
    Holly, analyses the luck virus and Rimmer gets pulled out into space and the ship gets hit with a meriorite composed of cesiumfrancilithicmixalubidiumrexydixydexydroxide.
     

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