"they look so old"

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by Slainmonkey, May 9, 2012.

  1. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    I know you've seen comments like that a lot since the publicity shot came out (not sure how much here though) but it struck me as kinda odd because really given how long it's been, they really haven't fared too badly....sure they look older but given the time that's passed they actually haven't changed all that jarringly....none of them really look run down of have become bloated or whatever. An interesting contrast would be too the Star Trek films in which the cast had aged even worse then Red Dwarf crew have but in the 80's people didn't seem to give a crap, they were just happy to have them back. Now it just seems like peoples attitudes are that the second people hit middle age then they might as well be hooked upto a dialysis machine.
     
  2. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    I've never really bought the criticism that them being old* is a bad thing anyway. If anything their ages can add to the comedy. It's not like they've ever been portrayed as the 'best of the crew', the 'cream of the crop', 'add your own cliché here', which is usually the case.

    Most sci-fi shows/films set on large ships are based around the bridge crew and the extremely talented. Red Dwarf's main characters are the lowest ranking least skilled people there are. Kryten is possibly an exception but he has other issues. I also like the fact they aren't just that though. Lister shows some technical skills later, and to be fair, I think his issues are mainly based on laziness rather than lack of skills and talent (although he is uneducated) but that's something else that appeals. They have the opportunity to improve... or the jokes on them if they don't.

    Onset age is just another thing for them to overcome.

    *Well, not old old. My Dad's older than them, and he's still full of beans, but I'm sure you know what I mean.
     
  3. Strat-tastic

    Strat-tastic Flight Co-Ordinator

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    I think Kryten looks the same age, which is probably realistic, unless he has an ageing subroutine which kicks in after 80 years' service....

    You could also argue that maybe Rimmer wouldn't age either.
     
  4. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    To me these just seem like complaints that spring from today's societies shallow ideals......I mean why is even being middle aged considered a bad thing because surly we will all get to the point where we too are that old (ignoring any tragic circumstances). I mean I find it stupid people see that as a problem because if it's good it shouldn't need to be "young and hip" to prove that. I have actually seen a lot of comments other places where people claim the actors should be replaced by younger people.....kinda annoying, not just for this show but the attitude in general.

    That certainly wasn't the case in "Out of Time", on top of this though one could argue that the "revived" Rimmer died years after season 8 had ended.
     
  5. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    I guess for me I tend to have a pretty apathetic view towards aging provided the seem like they are still fit for the role, because honestly they aren't looking too bad all things considered, I mean some people change a lot over that time.....I mean a good comparison for that would be to look at Alec Baldwin and then flash back to how he looked in Beetlejuice

    Then
    now

    ....kinda hard to believe it's the same guy, but the Dwarfer's are all still pretty recognizable. I guess it does serve as a reminder in how long it's been off the air but they all look ready to go, so that's good enough for me. I guess I also never really see Middle aged "so" old.
     
  6. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Well that's fair enough because in a relative term to how they were in the 80's you are certainly right, though I guess for me having seen that they were starting to get a middle aged look in the 8th series it really didn't hold much surprise for me.....I mean I'd imagine be more stunned if I hadn't seen them since season 1 and 2
     
  7. sundayforsammy

    sundayforsammy Deck Sergeant

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    I like that there is an ageing thing going on, the fact that they started of as young-uns 3 million years in space and trying to find there way back to earth. Now that there quite a bit older and still lost in space just adds to the futility of there plight which tells a story in its own right.
     
  8. 1234564

    1234564 Third Technician

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    They don't really to be honest. I watched Back to Earth straight after series VIII recently and I surprised to see that there actually wasn't that much of a difference in appearance of the actors in each series. They've got a few winkles, and Lister's become a bit stockier, but that's about it. OK, obviously there's make-up; wigs; hair-dye etc. on them to abate their inevitable ravages of age, but really I can't think of 3 people (Bobbyllew doesn't count because he's in a mask) who've aged so gracefully!

    I think "they look so old" is just something cool to say, that people utter without really thinking about it. Also there seems to be plenty of Red Dwarf 'fans' out there on the 'it shoulda ended at VI' bandwagon that are desperate for this series to fail and be awful so they can smugly (in true Comic Book Guy Fashion) tear it to shreds via their keyboard and broadband connection, 'they're too old' being a convenient excuse to proclaim it'll be terrible before it's even reached our screens. Sad really, although it seems to be an increasingly common facet of modern pop-culture - everyone's a critic, negativity is the new positivity and the more you can be negative about something, the more you can say how bad something is, the more faults about something you can point out (or invent if need be) the more fun you have and the cooler you are.
     
  9. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Well yeah.....I honestly thought they although looking a bit older didn't look too different, but enough to see some times has past like the things you mentioned and the fact that Barrie's hairline has receded a little. When I saw them I can't the I was hugely shocked because they all are very recognizable and all look fit to jump back in the roles. As such those complains stuck me as being pretty stupid and the more I stay here you'll likely be seeing that this is coming from a person who has a reputation of being very critical by nature. Having said that I don't understand the mentality about wanting something you once loved to fail (unless we are talking about new Simpsons, then it's more of a mercy killing) because while one might not be optimistic, on some level I think it would be great if it went well.....kinda like catching up with an old friend you haven't seen in years. Do I think there is a chance the new season will be a huge disappointment? Sure, I was disappointed with BTE but with all the effort seeming to go into this season, I hope it rises like a phoenix from the ashes.......and even if it doesn't the cast's age has nothing to do with that.
     
  10. goldy_T_O_T

    goldy_T_O_T Deck Sergeant

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    Actually I thought they look pretty good for their age in those shots. And I won't say any thing else since some one might hit me. LOL :shock: :-D
     
  11. Paul Taylor

    Paul Taylor Console Officer

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    We won't. We love you.

    Craig Charles is ten years older than me. If he feels ten years older than I feel, it doesn't show.
     
  12. Strat-tastic

    Strat-tastic Flight Co-Ordinator

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    But he can still make that Strat sing; some things you don't lose with age, rather you get even better.
     
  13. DeanField2686

    DeanField2686 Third Technician

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    the cast looking older isn't an issue for me really, it just adds to the illusion that they have been floating in space for a long time looking for a way home. im sure RDX wont just start off from the point of VIII ending, because we have not seen there adventures between VIII and X does not mean they did not happen... the events between VIII and X could be a time jump 10,20,30 years and it would'nt make a difference. :-)
     
  14. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    That is exactly the point I'm making, I think I noticed this maybe most on the Red Dwarf Facebook, people whining over the fact they look "old". It seems society has become so against aging (well I have seen things in the news about teenagers getting facelifts) that the second someone now isn't in their teens or early 20's they magically loose their ability to act and belong in a retirement home.....it's stupid.
     
  15. DeanField2686

    DeanField2686 Third Technician

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    i see a lot of these odd remarks about the cast on sites like facebook too, strange people lol, thats why i try to avoid smegbook & youtube... full of idiots being negative. its only because they are uneducated and got nothing constructive to comment about, in less its about what apps they have on a phone or a long and boring discussion about sportsmen playing badly (and they cant even run ten yards lol). not just sites though.. sadly this odd behaviour has trickled through at work and i sometimes wish i would slip in a coma so i wouldnt have to listen to it. hehe
     
  16. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    First off looking at your quoting me reminds me that I should take more mind of my spelling before I press the post button. I will say that I think that these days people are just seeming to become more shallow about such matters and honestly much of the media enforces that. That is why you have so many people saying that Red Dwarf should have been rebooted with younger actors......and knowing people these days they want it to be some Micheal Bayish shaky cam, explosion fest with barely cloths woman around to be seen as sex objects rather then people, kinda like what J.J. Abrams did with Star Trek........Okay maybe that an exaggeration but it does seem pretty common place with how many people seem to think these days and look for in their "entertainment" mediums. Given peoples priorities now I do hope the Red Dwarf can maintain the kinds of ratings the BTE specials did.
     
  17. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    I think they all look fine. And I look forward to seeing Lister with grey dreads, a big bushy beard and a metal arm in the future ;-)
     
  18. Slainmonkey

    Slainmonkey Deck Sergeant

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    Think you are overestimating the natural human lifespan for Craig Charles......my question is how does Lister live so long given how little he takes care of himself?
     
  19. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Hmm, dunno really...ask Doug? ;-) Perhaps he just goes into stasis many more times over the years. Or perhaps some kind of future technology could reverse the aging process?...

    But staying within the realms of our current real life time frame, while the latter part of my comment was meant to be taken in a slightly tongue-in-cheek sense...what's to say that (theoretically speaking) the show couldn't come back in ten/fifteen years time for one final series, a mini series, perhaps literally sub-titled "Old Men In Space" :-)

    Now, in the realistic timespan of the show itself that would mean it would need to be set further into the future of course, as Craig is obviously not going to live to the age 171 (the age of future Lister in Future Echoes).

    However *Warning: Geeky science mode engaged* As mentioned by someone on another recent thread, 'we can't slow down the aging process'...

    ...yet.

    In the future however, possibly in fifty years time according to certain sources, the natural aging process may have indeed been "solved", in that it may be possible to slow down, or reverse the aging process, thus allowing us to live for much longer than we do in this day and age (this is claimed by many scientists and researchers to have already been done with mice and other animals)...but maybe it will never be possible for us, as at the time of typing this there is a rather serious flaw in this process (based on the knowledge currently available).

    Diclaimer: Not that I necessarily think slowing down the aging process would be the "right" or responsible thing to do, but I do find the propossed science of it all quite fasinating.

    That may be one side of it, but the other side is that people are often unfairly made out to be villains due to an unhealthy side to group behaviour kicking in (both on screen among the housemates and by the audience also) and in many cases these people then seep into deep depression. Sometimes their careers are completely ruined by such extreme and bias reactions (often due to only seeing things from one controlled angle via clever editting in order to keep the "story line" afloat).

    And here's an alternate view regarding X-Factor or Britains Got Talent is (and this is based on a genuine case:-(

    - A young guy plays the guitar amazingly
    - Simon insults him and ironically accuses him of being pretentious
    - The audience are split - some laugh and some boo
    - The majority off the panal agree with Cowell for whatever reason
    - The young talented musician goes away feeling hurt, confused and disilusioned
     
  20. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Or, does that process initially begin the other way around? (regarding the audience wanting a story and producers pandering to it) In that the produces suck in the audience by inserting somewhat of a story line and the audience just eats it up, and subsequently demands more of the same? The producers then give them what they want in order to maintain ratings.

    I hope this isn't coming across as condescending or pedantic, It's really not meant to be, I just like offering alternative views and different angles really, but certainly not in a trolley way..:-)

    In the case of the US big Brother and shows like Wife Swap or Holiday Swap (or whatever it's called) this is often known to be the way it works to a certain extent, so far as purposely planning right from the start to manipulate the perceptions of the audience in certain ways. I don't think the UK shows are quite as bad for that, but it certainly exists to an extent. I'm not saying they're all as inherently staged as the likes as 'The Two Coreys season one' (Cory Feldman claims season two was a rare glimpse into genuine reality tv, but he completely admits most of season one was completely scripted, based on the media's perception of their characters), but there is very little 'reality tv' nowadays, if any. In the sense of it being as straight forward a social experiment or documentary style reality show as it perhaps was at one point.

    For this reason, along with the continuing "freak show" trends (the purposeful 'casting' of certain 'types' of people who will, for whatever reason cause a stir with the public) I personally have little interest in 'reality tv' nowadays. Although I have no shame in admitting that I used to watch Big Brother at one point, I preferred that survival island one though (again I forget the name of it).

    Maybe I enjoyed them for slightly different reasons to a large portion of it's core audience...or perhaps not. Either way I can still see the appeal in such shows. I just wish the structure would change somewhat. From what it's become now to more of a genuine study in social behaviour in these situations - putting a nice variety of people together, not just those who are oh so wacky or 'controversial' or whatever. Which doesn't mean it can't still be fun of course...but it might mean it wouldn't be as easily marketable to the majority of a mainstream audience of course.
     

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