Those bits in Red Dwarf you just don't get...

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by codename_47, Dec 2, 2011.

  1. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Well mostly I recall UK Gold 2 as I think it started life, or perhaps that was after UK Gold Classics (personally I don't remember that name, so it might have been the earliest one), then came its contracted evolution of UKG2, and its current form. I can't help but think I'm missing one. Even if I'm not, four names for a TV channel over what isn't really a huge number of years (about a decade or so I think?) is quite a lot , at least in my eyes. Even if they are primarily evolutions of themselves for the most part. Still think I'm missing one in there though...

    Of course I may well just be misremembering all this, being senile and all in my old age.
     
  2. Freeborn

    Freeborn Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Agreed.

    Obviously in 'reality' there is nothing pretentious about having a hologram reading the news. I could be wrong but I percieved Rimmer's reaction as just Rimmer being Rimmer. "Holograms reading the news?, preposterous! No respectable channel would allow that. What next, women given equal wages!?...if you ask me Listie it's overly modernized, youth pleasing political correctness gone mad...no, there has to be a natural order of things!" that kind of thing..;-).
     
  3. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    Seeing as we have channels today such as Dave, Red Hot TV and Five Star, I don't think Groovy Channel Twenty-Seven is too preposterous.

    I always figured that with the little dance he does, Rimmer is sarcastically reenacting a jingle for said TV station.
     
  4. Seb

    Seb Captain Staff Member

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    As ever, Wikipedia has shown us the way:

    UK Gold Classics (1998-1999)
    UK Gold 2 (1999-2003)
    UKG² (2003-2004)
    UKTV G2 (2004-2007)
     
  5. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    This has proven three things:

    1. I am not as senile as I thought.
    2. I am as lazy as I thought for not bothering to research this myself (many thanks Mr Patrick for your diligence).
    3. Five names in fourteen years, although the UK G2 to UKTV G2 was a complete rebranding of the whole UK group to UKTV if I recall, still strikes me as a lot of name changes for a TV channel.
     
  6. Seymour_Clufley

    Seymour_Clufley First Technician

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    To return (rather clumsily) to the issue of Cat never having seen a woman before, I thought what it meant was that he had never seen a woman before, only females of his own species.

    I've been working my way through the whole series (currently at s4) and a few things came up which I realised I've never understood...

    In Marooned, Rimmer says he lost his virginity to some girl when he was a teenager. But earlier, we've been told his only sexual experience was with Yvonne McGruder.

    In Timeslides, Rimmer "beams" into rich Lister's dining room... but the visual recording (the Ruby Wax video) was from outside the mansion, so presumably he would "beam in" there? And also, isn't it bizarre that the freaky developing fluid would even work on a still taken from a video? (Yes, I know the thing is already pretty bizarre!)

    Again in Timeslides, they need a visual recording of something to get to the place... why did somebody take a photo of a bunch of boys asleep at boarding school?!

    Yet again in Timeslides, what happened to the people taking the photos - at Rimmer's boarding school and at Lister's pub - when they saw 4 guys from the future suddenly appearing in front of them?

    The final problem in Timeslides is the "timing" of Thickie Holden patenting the Tension Sheet. Presumably he did it the next day when young Rimmer was at extra rugby practice. Now, since he was so thick, it would make sense that he only ever got the idea for the Tension Sheet because of overhearing adult Rimmer telling his young self about it. This is how the original timeline must have been... So how did Lister's patenting it ever work?

    In The Last Day, it's a remarkable coincidence that Hudzen 10 catches up with Kryten immediately after the RD crew have picked Kryten up. I suppose you could explain this away by saying that being on Red Dwarf meant Kryten was travelling towards Hudzen, thus greatly increasing the speed at which they were approaching each other (I presume Red Dwarf moves faster than Hudzen's capsule).

    Again in The Last Day, I've never understood what Lister means when he says of the topless female boxing video: "I'm just praying that it goes the distance" - unless he's talking about masturbation.

    Not an internal story error, but a technical point. In The Last Day, the Jim Reaper video appears to have been shot on film... Does anyone have an explanation for that?

    In Dimension Jump, Ace Rimmer would have to have been dimension jumping for 3 million years in order to meet our RD crew.

    While I'm at it, in Quarantine, Rimmer says "W.O.O." as the acronym for "without oxygen". But surely that's just two words? W.O.?

    I know there are other things, but damn it, I didn't write them down! (And yes, I know it's just a sitcom, etc. etc.!)
     
  7. Mardroid

    Mardroid Console Officer

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    That only need be true if he crosses over into the equivalent time frame when crossing universes. That's not the case here. For some reason, when Ace crossed over into our Dwarfer's universe he left his 23rd century behind and entered their universe 3 million years further on. Of course that's a bit strange in itself and does lead to another question:

    If crossing universes somehow causes one to automatically zero in on your counterpart in that universe, why did he end up near our Dwarfers since that Rimmer had been dead for three million years. (Bear in mind, our Rimmer is actually a holographic simulation, albeit one who thinks and feels like the original.)

    Don't get me wrong this doesn't bother me. Just interesting* thoughts that occurred to me.

    *To me anyway.
     
  8. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    In the books it was declared that Rimmer was lying during this exchange, trying to make himself seem more experienced, but in reality Sandra was a fabrication.

    "Thickie" is a nasty nickname given to him, but you need to remember that just because a person may not be academically brilliant, or competent even as we are led to believe, doesn't mean they are useless. Clearly at some later point in the original timeline Fred Holden became inspired to create the tension sheet by some other circumstance. In the re-written timeline it was just the sudden appearance of our Arnie that caused him to patent the idea a lot earlier.

    Precisely. See Better Than Life, when they caught up with the post pod having turned around.

    Or he just wants those jiggling breasts on screen for as long as possible, as I'd assume once the match ends the girls put their tops back on. I think it rather apparent he's not doing anything except watching it, and just enjoying the show.

    Used for effect, so he can take his time and say slowly "With. Out. Oxygen." There are other examples of single words being condensed into two letters for an acronym, either because of different syllables, a long word, or because it'll sound better (see DNA, which stands Deoxyribonucleic Acid, which is only two words with the first letters of DA, but they chose DNA instead to be its official acronym, I'm assuming because DA is a pretty commonplace pairing).


    Those are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
     
  9. Seb

    Seb Captain Staff Member

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    In acronym form, the extra "O" is added for "without", to differentiate it from "with". If it were "W.O.", it wouldn't be immediately clear if it meant "with oxygen" or "without oxygen". An obvious comparison point would be the well-known A.W.O.L.
     
  10. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    The thing with the timeslides, I thought, was that time is passing within the photos. Perhaps a young Rimmer took a photo of his bedroom in the evening and then went to bed. Rimmer could have animated the photograph, waited for everyone to fall asleep and then stepped into the photo. Either that, or he had a shifty housemaster.

    With the 'Lifestyles of the Disgustingly Rich and Famous' video, perhaps later on in the video there's a part where the camera moves inside the house, allowing Rimmer to appear inside.
     
  11. karnie

    karnie Supply Officer

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    What exactly did Rimmer use to clone himself on Rimmerworld, having no discernible DNA to copy?
     
  12. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Perhaps it was some component of the hard light drive. Sort of create a perfect synthetic copy of the DNA that could read by the cloning technology and thus used to create a fully organic clone of the hologram. Or generate some form of software version of the DNA that would be compatible with a cloning machine (the hard light technology is in some respects a form of cloning if you think about it, so it might be a feasible cross-over with such a genius team at the helm).
     
  13. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    So in Ouroboros, there's a flashback sequence with Rimmer, Lister and Kochanski. But whose flashback is it?

    It appears to be our Lister's, but if so then why does Kochanski end up looking after the cat? If it's the hologram Lister's flashback then why isn't he talking with the posh voice that he speaks with in the scenes set in the present?
     
  14. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    I think it starts as a sort of joint flashback with Lister, as the two of them were still in much the same place then (so it was before Kochanski's Lister became the posher man), but as it progresses along it sort of devolves into just Kochanski's. Or, to put it another way, the flashback is told from an omniscient viewpoint, rather than a specific character's, so we are just watching events unfold as they did in Kochanski's universe. The same viewpoint we watch each episode from basically, just in flashback form.
     
  15. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    Yes, I think your synopsis is probably correct. It helps makes sense out of something that's always confused me.
     
  16. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    The flashback was the events in Kochanski's dimension, though the point of divergence is most likely that of the cat meowing. There are also more subtle differences, like the penalty for breaking quarantine being six months in stasis as opposed to the eighteen months Lister got in 'The End'.

    Plus, on the subject of Lister's talking voice, the Lister we see in the flashback is before his death, revival and obvious etiquette lessons at the hands of Kochanski. The implication I got was that aside from his holographic status making him more sensitive, Kochanski has moulded him into her ideal man but lost the inherent Listerness that she finds appealing in the uncouth Lister we all know and love.
     
  17. Bluey

    Bluey Science Officer

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    Strange though that the alternate Cat also speaks with a more refined accent. Kochanski must have somehow influenced him as well.
     
  18. Daniel

    Daniel Console Officer

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    Considering they all seemed to be turned into a more... shall we say "refined" sort of person under Kochanski, if her story of them all loving that game of "The Magic Flute" is anything to go, I don't think it's too surprising to find Cat speaking in a more polished, formalised manner as well.
     
  19. SixthDwarfer

    SixthDwarfer Supply Officer

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    Stands to reason Cat would turn out more refined and cultured under Kochanski. I read an interesting fan-fiction once which told the story of Kochanski's crew. According to the story, instead of using his laundry list and old t-shirt's to line Frankenstein's basket, Kochanski lined Frankenstein's basket with pages torn out of a Jane Austen novel. Consequently, her Cat is still somewhat dimwitted and horny, but he does it in the manner of a aristocratic gentleman of the nineteenth century. All dashing bravado, charm and eloquence.
     
  20. kiowa13

    kiowa13 Skutter

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    (first of all just want to say love this thread, especially since reading it all earlier distracted me nicely from the football on the tv for a bit!)

    Anyway, when I first watched The End and Rimmer has just been brought back as a Hologram and introduced to Lister as one, at the end of their argument he leans to the side as if to rest his hand on a surface but, of course being a hologram without the ability to touch, his arm goes all the way through it.

    But he seems to have no problem of resting on his bunk and sitting on various chairs throughout the ship without the misfortune of disappearing through them.

    I can completely understand that the disappearing hand through the console(?) and Lister's hand swiping through him in the first episode were simply scenes to make it very clear that Rimmer is now a hologram and can't touch anything, but was just wondering if there was ever any other explanation for this?
    Holly not initially giving full power and attention to the hologram simulation suite perhaps...
     

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