Well, well, well

Discussion in 'THE AIGBURTH ARMS' started by neilold, Jul 13, 2018.

  1. neilold

    neilold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    An interesting week in politics. The brexit treaty in turmoil, and mister trump telling us a few home truths.
     
  2. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Console Officer

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    What "home truths"? Trump's a corrupt incompetent embarrassment as President.
     
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  3. neilold

    neilold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    He stated that the millions that have flooded I to our country is very sad. He also said Sadiq khan hadn't handled terrorism very well, and that the prime minister has handled brexit poorly.
     
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  4. Cloud

    Cloud Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Did he offer any potential solutions or suggestions or just say these things are bad?
     
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  5. Underdunn

    Underdunn Supply Officer

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    Yes he said we should all have guns, have to pay to use hospitals and we should go and play golf with a murderous Korean dictator. Apparently that'll sort it.
     
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  6. Nikki the Great

    Nikki the Great Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Good old Hitler Wotsit
     
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  7. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Console Officer

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    Immigration to the UK in 2017 was less than 250,000. That's not millions flooding our country by any reasonably objective assessment.

    There hasn't been a terrorist attack in London in over a year now.

    That at least is something I would agree with, but making that comment during an official visit to the US's strongest international ally just brings home the man's complete lack of any kind of diplomatic skills or competence, especially considering his behaviour in North Korea.
     
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  8. Asclepius

    Asclepius Deck Sergeant

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    I think if Obama had started talks with North Korea, everybody would be like "Oh, he is bringing peace to world."
    But when Trump does it, everbody is like "Oh, he is friend with a dictator. :sulk:"
     
  9. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Console Officer

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    I disagree. Firstly the Obama administration, like pretty much every one in my lifetime, did have talks with North Korea. More significantly though Obama got an actual deal done with Iran on massively reducing their civilian nuclear program and effectively ending their military one, the result was that Trump threw that deal out of the door pretty much out of spite.

    Don't forget as well that the tensions with North Korea were stoked by Trump himself, remember the "Fire and Fury" speech? So he gets zero credit for de-escelating tensions that he caused and gets zero credit for giving the Koreans concessions in exchange for nothing whilst destroying a deal in which genuine meaningful concessions were made.

    Trump makes Bush look positively statesmanlike and let's face it, considering the foreign and domestic policy baggage that goes with the Bush Jnr administration that's going quite some to achieve that level of incompetence.

    Edit: It's also not just that he had talks with the North Koreans, it's the awful stuff he said, sucking up to Kim Jong Un and glossing over the NK's horrendous human rights records.
     
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  10. Underdunn

    Underdunn Supply Officer

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    Okay stand down everyone, Trump has declared the interview Neil is referring to here as FAKE NEWS!!!!

    So we're okay.
     
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  11. neilold

    neilold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Fake news! How very dare you!!!!
     
  12. Underdunn

    Underdunn Supply Officer

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    Sorry, just to be clear. That wasn't a joke. He really has.
     
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  13. Asclepius

    Asclepius Deck Sergeant

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    Well, it is nonsense to ditch the deal, but note there are evidences from Israel about Iran not following the deal.
    There are talks between Pompeo (what a funny name...) and North Korean administration. It looks like the de-nuclearization is really happening. Or I hope so.
    Yes, I don't see any other reason behind Trump saying Kim is very talented that that Trump's advisers told him to be nice to Kim. It suprises me, because we all know Trumps egoistic personality, but it's very diplomatical in this situation, because Kim can easily take offense and stop negotiate.
     
  14. Eddiebadassdavis

    Eddiebadassdavis Supply Officer

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    you do love hackney old cliches don't you
     
  15. Underdunn

    Underdunn Supply Officer

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    That's no way to talk about our taxis. :crying:
     
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  16. Simonr1978

    Simonr1978 Console Officer

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    Then perhaps the better route might have been to use the checks and balances that were part of the deal to establish whether this was the case or not, especially as the Israelis are (For understandable historical reasons) not exactly the most unbiased source in the region. And if Iran for example refused to comply then you multi-laterally withdraw the deal rather than unilaterally behaving like a spoilt child and pulling out basically just to spite your predecessor.

    Way too early to make any such predictions and I really wouldn't bank on it. Their nukes are the only real international bargaining chip the North Koreans have and they've used them successfully and repeatedly over the last few decades to leverage concessions and aid from the international community by making concessions to reduce their program before ramping it up again later and repeating the cycle.

    The Kim family will also be not unaware of other dictatorships globally that decommissioned their own WMD programs and what happened to them and probably don't have any great desire to become the next Hussein or Gadaffi.

    I doubt Trump really listens to advisers or is even really capable of doing so in any meaningful way (If he was, he would not for example have left the US military to find out that their exercises were cancelled through the news media rather than informing directly first) and it's poor diplomacy by any standards, whilst it would also have been poor diplomacy to have gone in full guns blazing, criticising Kim Jong Un's regime and, say threatening "Fire and fury like the world has never seen", there is a middle ground between the two that would not be seen as legitimizing a murderous dictatorship.

    It's also remarkable that he seems incapable of behaving in any even remotely flattering kind of way to those nations that are supposed to be US allies, such as Germany, France or Britain.

    The man is a terrible businessman and a terrible president.
     
  17. neilold

    neilold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Our man Mr Farage has been doing his usual stirring, with talk of a comeback, which is either great or terrible, depending on your view of him.
     
  18. Ant E

    Ant E Flight Co-Ordinator

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    Andrew Ellard has little option but to resign. That’s my take on the matter.
     
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  19. Nikki the Great

    Nikki the Great Flight Co-Ordinator

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  20. neilold

    neilold Flight Co-Ordinator

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    I thought he'd resigned ages ago
     

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