What year is it?

Discussion in 'RED DWARF UNIVERSE' started by Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century, Sep 25, 2016.

  1. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    It's roughly the year 3,002,292, right?

    We get the year 2077 in Stasis Leak as the year of the radiation leak.
    Lister is in Stasis for three million years.
    Plus deep sleep for two hundred years at the start of Psirens.
    He says it's been "five, six years, not counting stasis" from "The End" to "Back in the Red"
    Then we get "nine years later" at the start of BTE.
     
  2. Seb

    Seb Captain Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,775
    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2011
    Location:
    JMC HQ
    It's basically an impossible one to nail down. The 2077 date was contradicted at later times (and you can argue quite convincingly that everything post-Series III takes place in at least one different timeline from Series I and II), and it's rarely stated how much time has passed between (or, indeed, during) each series.

    The only thing that can really be said is that in terms of the crew's personal timeline as they've experienced it (and thus as they've aged), we are basically about thirty years after the accident at this point. In other words, Lister is - as he always has been - roughly as old as Craig Charles is (give or take a few years, given that he turned 28 circa 1997 "our" time, and Craig was in his early 30s by then).
     
  3. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    1,427
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Does 2077 appear anywhere other than the Stasis Leak calendar? It's so hard to reconcile with other dates that I like to pretend it's a metric other than years, like "millions of miles from Earth" or something (similar to the stats you see on a flight, when you look at the map with the little plane). I seem to recall freeze-framing it, and thinking it only looked like the date because it was in the low two thousands.
     
  4. Almighty_crj

    Almighty_crj First Technician

    Messages:
    144
    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2009
    Nope, you've forgotten something. Starbug has got to GET BACK to the Esperanto. They were in stasis for that.

    200 years/3 (300% faster, courtesy of Epideme)= 67 years
     
  5. smegrightoff

    smegrightoff Third Technician

    Messages:
    33
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2016
    Wouldn't it be 50 years? 300% faster would be four times as fast! 100% faster would be twice as fast, not equally as fast! Easy mistake to make!
     
  6. Almighty_crj

    Almighty_crj First Technician

    Messages:
    144
    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2009
    So we have: 3000000+200+(200/4)+6+9=3000265 years after the accident.

    So the date for Back to Earth is 3,002,(X+2)(Y+6)(Z+5) where XYZ cannot be greater than 340.

    For 2077, it would be 3,002,342
     
  7. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    1,427
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    This is my kind of newbie.
     
  8. Dismembers

    Dismembers Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    2,349
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2013
    Location:
    London
    Have we taken into account the fact that if they are traveling eastwards they gain an extra day every 80? Apparently. Or something.
     
  9. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    2077 (Ref: Stasis Leak)
    + 3000000 stasis (Ref: The End)
    + 200 deep sleep (Ref: Psirens)
    + 50 stasis (Ref: Nanarchy)
    + 5/6 non-stasis from Series I - start of VIII (Ref: Back in the Red I)
    + 9 between VIII & BTE (Ref: BTE I)
    = 3002341/2

    + Series VIII
    + BTE
    + Series X
    + Twentica & Samsara

    So we're probably well into 3002343.
     
  10. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    1,427
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    I hate to say it, but, given the speeds involved, we might have to take relativity (i.e., time dilation) into effect.
     
  11. Dismembers

    Dismembers Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    2,349
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2013
    Location:
    London
    yeah and leap years.
     
  12. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    + 4000 years in stasis while Red Dwarf turned around (Ref: Future Echoes)
    = 3006343
     
  13. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    We actually get a definite year in [a certain episode of XI]. 2978340.
     
  14. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    That would be a good fix except Lister looks at it and remarks "that's three weeks before the accident" or words to that effect, confirming it's the date.

    Here's another fix though: In the future, the date of Christ's birth gets (quite radically) revised to 103 AD. 2077 by their calendar actually means 2180 by ours, matching up with Lister being put under the pool table in 2155 and being 25 when he went into stasis. Or maybe in the future society stops dating from Christ's birth and starts dating from something that happened in 103 AD.

    Here's another fix: Lister put himself under the pool table in the wrong year.
     
  15. Abe but more Halloween themed

    Abe but more Halloween themed Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    1,209
    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2016
    Location:
    Tomorrow
    Maybe he just knows that it's three weeks before the accident in terms of date, not necessarily year, perhaps assuming that it's the year of the accident, maybe because he recognizes someone onboard who was new.
     
  16. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    [​IMG]

    I really don't think there's any ambiguity about 2077 being the year.

    LISTER: March the twenty-second. That's what, three weeks before the crew got wiped out?

    He doesn't actually mention the year, which is odd. As if it's a given that the stasis leak would go back to 2077. Why remark on the specific date but not the year? Still, if he noticed the date then he noticed the year. I suppose it's strictly possible that the accident happened on April 12th some later year and Lister just made another one of his woefully misleading time-related comments. I note that he also got the date wrong anyway, the clock says 2 not 22.

    Still, while you may have found an ambiguity as to when the accident was, Stasis Leak still says Lister was onboard in 2077, presenting a continuity error with Ouroborous where he was placed under the pool table in 2155, and D.N.A. where he claimed to be an "enlightened 23rd century guy".
     
  17. R.I.P. 2000

    R.I.P. 2000 Deck Sergeant

    Messages:
    1,427
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Well it's clearly meant to be the year, lol. But it doesn't say "year", so there's some scope to hand-wave it away with a tenuous fix.

    I mean, there's no two ways round it. They retconned the dates. So some imagination is required here!
     
  18. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    I can't help but wonder why they retconned the dates. I remember an interview where they discussed their reasons for retconning Lister's relationship with Kochanski, where they felt having him trying to "win back" an ex would be more sympathetic than having him trying to get a date with a girl he fancied. But I can't work out what the point was in moving the timeline forward a century.

    The script actually says "He emerges in the men's shower room on the other side of the wall, but three million years in the past. A digital clock above the wall mirrors gives the date as being 22nd March 2077".
     
  19. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    That still doesn't explain the clock saying 2077. We could say the clock was simply broken - that it always showed 2077 no matter what the year and all the crew knew it. Lister comments "March 2nd, that's three weeks before the crew got wiped out". He refers to the day and month, but not the year. He already knew what year they leaked into because he had already been reading Rimmer's Diary. But by that logic he already knew what date they came out in, so there's no need for him to remark on the date at all.

    If I travelled back in time and found out it was September 23rd, I wouldn't remark "that's three weeks before the Battle of Hastings" unless I knew it was 1066. Because any date is three weeks before something if you don't know the year.

    So here goes my fix:

    1 The clock is wrong. It was long-broken before the accident, showing the correct date, but the year was stuck on 2077 and all the crewmembers knew it, which is why neither Lister nor Rimmer remarked on it. Cat didn't remark "but the clock says 2077" because the clock still says 2077 in the year 3000000+, so he knew too. The clock being stuck on 2077 was a well-established fact amongst the Dwarfers off-camera.

    2 The stasis leak actually took them to March 2nd 2180, three weeks before the accident.

    3 They all knew it was 2180 because they'd been reading Rimmer's diary. The entry with Rimmer's "hallucinations" was March 2nd 2180, therefore they all knew the stasis leak would take them to that date.

    4 Lister made the comment "that's three weeks before the accident" purely for Cat's benefit, since Rimmer and Lister already knew. Up until that point, no one had ever explained to Cat (or indeed the audience!) exactly when the accident was. Lister had neglected to explain this to Cat when reading Rimmer's diary to him.

    It just occured to me that there's going to be a Stasis Leak day just like there was a Back to the Future Day recently. Marty Mcfly went to a specific date in 2015 and it was celebrated when the real day happened. There is going to be real March 2nd 2077, which few of us here will see, but there will still be Dwarfers on that day and they will be in mega-ecstacy-bliss (if the ants haven't taken over).
     
  20. Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century

    Deep_Space_in_the_15th_Century Supply Officer

    Messages:
    862
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2016
    Location:
    Deep Space in the 15th Century
    Problem: In Thanks for the Memory, Rimmer describes Captain Hollister as "Mr. Fat Bastard, 2044". I know it's a joke and there probably wasn't a real Mr. Fat Bastard competition, but it's still a date reference. It means Hollister was conceivably a young man in the 2040s, which fits in with 2077. If Hollister was 18 in 2044 he'd be 51 in 2077. Mac McDonald was 40 in Stasis Leak, but I don't think it's a huge stretch, especially in Red Dwarf where Kochanski is still 31. It's certainly less of a stretch than Rimmer picking 2044 if it was 2180. Why would Rimmer choose a year a century before Hollister was born.
     

Share This Page